Carpet_pissr wrote:And I hear the ‘but it has merit! Consider the ability to connect even more easily with like-minded peers!’ In fact that’s my wife’s favorite argument, and trots it out every time I grumble about social.
For a lot of kids, Instagram/Twitter etc are their Octopus Overlords. I mean, this forum is social media.
I feel like it's an umbrella term to sweepingly criticize what we don't like about specific social media applications. Which again points to why this whole concept of age restricting it is so ridiculous. I bet Hawley can't even define what he's wanting to restrict.
Unagi wrote:Imagine growing up under the context of a presidential candidate being recorded declaring that he was free to grab women by the pussy, who was then elected... and then all that transpired in his presidency.
I can't imagine any kid that was paying even a little attention (or listened to their parents that have been paying even a little attention) hasn't pretty much entirely dismissed this government.
And that's how I was raised about Carter, and how others were raised about Reagan.
It's always something. But the top of my list would 100% be Vietnam as traumatic for teens. I don't see how anything else can compare. Let's draft you or your brother for a war on the other side of the world, that barely makes any sense. At least Iraq had an inkling of motive and nobody was drafted.
Black Lives Matter
"To wield Grond, the mighty hammer of the Federal Government, is to be intoxicated with power beyond what you and I can reckon (though I figure we can ball park it pretty good with computers and maths). Need to tunnel through a mountain? Grond. Kill a mighty ogre? Grond. Hangnail? Grond. Spider? Grond (actually, that's a legit use, moreso than the rest)." - Peacedog
YellowKing wrote: ↑Tue Feb 28, 2023 4:42 pm
I feel like it's an umbrella term to sweepingly criticize what we don't like about specific social media applications. Which again points to why this whole concept of age restricting it is so ridiculous. I bet Hawley can't even define what he's wanting to restrict.
Yes, there is zero chance social media could be defined in such a way that didn't automatically encompass half the internet.
But I'd rather discuss the supposedly "intuitively obvious" harm that is being done to children. So much so, that laws need to be created. The laws themselves will not have the impact they are intended to, but that comes later.
For my kids? Social media is Discord. For me? It would have been Usenet or MUDs (had I had access to those before 16 - I was 20 when I actually did get access. Is Reddit social media? The comment section on Blue's News? Does Board Game Geek need to check IDs? Do MMOs? And if Discord is social media, is Zoom?
What about beneficial uses? My son's behaviorist and case manager communicate with him over Facebook as part of his therapy/training. That could have just as easily started when he was younger (and happens with other, younger kids now.)
And as others have said, age confirmation short of universal IDs with biometrics is meaningless.
This (legislation) is such an absurdly impractical idea from any standpoint that it doesn't even bear serious discussion.
The issues around the harmful effects of social media (and other current technologies) on kids (and on adults!) absolutely do, though.
The Josh Hawleys of the world don't care about science, though, else they'd allow us to study gun violence. Funny how "common sense legislation" only applies to their pet issues.
noxiousdog wrote: ↑Tue Feb 28, 2023 4:48 pm
the top of my list would 100% be Vietnam as traumatic for teens. I don't see how anything else can compare. Let's draft you or your brother for a war on the other side of the world, that barely makes any sense. At least Iraq had an inkling of motive and nobody was drafted.
When I was 10 or 11, my second-best friend's older brother was plucked from his life and sent to Vietnam. A year later he was dead. That definitely shapes a young man's worldview. And when adults tell you he died "defending his country" like he was a fucking hero, that sticks with you, too. My dad, a patriotic WW2 vet, maintained that when your country calls, you do your duty. Right or wrong is not up to you. That was a permanent rift between us.
IDK if that fits into the thread topic at all but it felt worth saying.
noxiousdog wrote: ↑Tue Feb 28, 2023 4:48 pm
the top of my list would 100% be Vietnam as traumatic for teens. I don't see how anything else can compare. Let's draft you or your brother for a war on the other side of the world, that barely makes any sense. At least Iraq had an inkling of motive and nobody was drafted.
When I was 10 or 11, my second-best friend's older brother was plucked from his life and sent to Vietnam. A year later he was dead. That definitely shapes a young man's worldview. And when adults tell you he died "defending his country" like he was a fucking hero, that sticks with you, too. My dad, a patriotic WW2 vet, maintained that when your country calls, you do your duty. Right or wrong is not up to you. That was a permanent rift between us.
IDK if that fits into the thread topic at all but it felt worth saying.
Well, this also ties into my point about measurability, and whether teens are really more depressed now to begin with. This isn't my core expertise so I want to be cautious on this, but I feel pretty confident in saying that we track teen depression much more extensively now than we used to. So are teens actually more depressed now than 50 years ago (during the Vietnam era) or are we just finally measuring and tracking that now? Or at least doing so better / more extensively?
noxiousdog wrote: ↑Tue Feb 28, 2023 4:48 pm
the top of my list would 100% be Vietnam as traumatic for teens. I don't see how anything else can compare. Let's draft you or your brother for a war on the other side of the world, that barely makes any sense. At least Iraq had an inkling of motive and nobody was drafted.
When I was 10 or 11, my second-best friend's older brother was plucked from his life and sent to Vietnam. A year later he was dead. That definitely shapes a young man's worldview. And when adults tell you he died "defending his country" like he was a fucking hero, that sticks with you, too. My dad, a patriotic WW2 vet, maintained that when your country calls, you do your duty. Right or wrong is not up to you. That was a permanent rift between us.
IDK if that fits into the thread topic at all but it felt worth saying.
My dad is sort a of Viet Nam vet, serving on the Kitty Hawk as Viet Nam escalated but home by the mid/late 60s. He maintains you serve when called. But he also wanted to keep all his children and grandchildren out of the military and has an anti globalist air to his politics... He failed to keep two of his children out of the military and so far one of his grandchildren. I also would have joined but was turned down for medical.
One does have to wonder if the mistrust of government concurrent with being suckered by the worst of it, is somehow tied to coming of age during that era. I don't think it did so much to the children of the ear.
YellowKing wrote: ↑Tue Feb 28, 2023 6:34 pm
The Josh Hawleys of the world don't care about science, though, else they'd allow us to study gun violence. Funny how "common sense legislation" only applies to their pet issues.
Sure, but my point is more directed at those who are leaning in this direction. Bring me peer reviewed, agreed upon science and I'll consider passing laws. Until then, I'm unlikely to be on board.
Yeah I think we're in perfect agreement. I'm not ready to start putting guardrails on an issue I don't understand (and frankly don't know even exists).
LordMortis wrote: ↑Wed Mar 01, 2023 7:06 am
My dad is sort a of Viet Nam vet, serving on the Kitty Hawk as Viet Nam escalated but home by the mid/late 60s.
One of the best friends I've ever had (who, unfortunately, died a few years ago) served on the Kitty Hawk (or, as he said, "The Shitty Kitty") during Vietnam.
