Octopus Overlords

Skinypupy wrote: ↑Thu May 11, 2023 9:34 am

El Guapo wrote: ↑Thu May 11, 2023 9:27 am Yeah, more than anything else I really want to know how that audience happened. Did they blithely follow whatever their normal town hall procedures and (unsurprisingly) wind up with that audience because Trump's people got the word out to their e-mail lists? More than anything else that audience made a mockery of any attempt for this to be a serious journalistic event (if that was ever really possible).

I read somewhere yesterday (will have to try and find it now) that it was intentional by CNN. They specifically and deliberately picked Republican and "Lean Republican Independents" for the audience.

Whether that was to make Trump more comfortable or simply to generate the level of deplorable that we witnessed (everyone is talking about CNN this morning, right?) is still up for debate, but it was absolutely intentional.

It's disgusting, but I would not be shocked to learn that this was part of Team Trump's conditions for the event.

That gets me into another worry. I'm struggling to remember the details here, but didn't CNN get some new conservative board member or something? As I recall made me worry that MAGA people were trying to de facto capture CNN / make it more friendly, and this would seem to deepen that worry.

I wish I could remember where I saw it but I read something about CNN trying to position themselves as the "new" Fox News. To scoop up their viewers and that that was part of what brought about the firing on Lemon (I'm really not sure I buy that part of it even if the rest feels possible). The town hall outcome (I didn't watch and won't watch trump as he makes me feel ill) seems to back up the idea they are trying to gain that audience.

edit: What Guapo said above was part of it too

Skinypupy wrote: ↑Thu May 11, 2023 9:34 am

El Guapo wrote: ↑Thu May 11, 2023 9:27 am Yeah, more than anything else I really want to know how that audience happened. Did they blithely follow whatever their normal town hall procedures and (unsurprisingly) wind up with that audience because Trump's people got the word out to their e-mail lists? More than anything else that audience made a mockery of any attempt for this to be a serious journalistic event (if that was ever really possible).

I read somewhere yesterday (will have to try and find it now) that it was intentional by CNN. They specifically and deliberately picked Republican and "Lean Republican Independents" for the audience.

More than intentional. They colloborated with the Trump campaign. Several people noted that previous and likely soon to be Trump campaign workers were spotted in the audience. There were emails sent from Trump 'fan club' email lists to get people to show up. It was a Trump rally disguised as a news event. That's why we should turn away from CNN. They became part of his campaign last night. Maybe it was one night only but let's not pretend this was a typical media event. It was staged and controlled by Trump from beginning to end.

Whether that was to make Trump more comfortable or simply to generate the level of deplorable that we witnessed (everyone is talking about CNN this morning, right?) is still up for debate, but it was absolutely intentional.

Exactly and why I'm done with CNN. It's literally blocked in my home now. I will not give them a cent. I don't fund oppression. Here or anywhere.

Remus West wrote: ↑Thu May 11, 2023 9:39 am I wish I could remember where I saw it but I read something about CNN trying to position themselves as the "new" Fox News. To scoop up their viewers and that that was part of what brought about the firing on Lemon (I'm really not sure I buy that part of it even if the rest feels possible). The town hall outcome (I didn't watch and won't watch trump as he makes me feel ill) seems to back up the idea they are trying to gain that audience.

From a business perspective, it makes sense that they would make that pivot. No one watches cable news anymore except boomers and they skew significantly conservative.

There was a study done back in 2014 that looked at where liberals and conservatives got their news from. Liberals were all over the map, split evenly over a bunch of different sources. Conservatives were Fox News and Fox News only. That was their only source and they were fiercely loyal to it.

I think CNN is realizing that the only way they survive is to peel off some of that loyal audience by pandering to the MAGA's. Otherwise, they risk just being one of many news sources and that won't draw the eyeballs they need. And with Fox wobbling at the moment, there's no better time than right now to shoot their shot with the deplorables.

El Guapo wrote: ↑Thu May 11, 2023 9:36 am That gets me into another worry. I'm struggling to remember the details here, but didn't CNN get some new conservative board member or something?

New CEO, Chris Licht.

Had to dig into the Internet archive for this article originally posted in August of 2022:

Former President Donald Trump portrayed CNN as an enemy, and a Pew Research Center study illustrated the impact that had with his followers. In 2014, Pew found that one-third of people who identify or lean Republican said they distrusted CNN as a source for political news. By 2019, that number had shot up to 58 percent — higher distrust than The New York Times, The Washington Post or MSNBC.

...

Being seen as a liberal alternative to Fox News Channel isn't an issue for a news outlet that plays up partisanship. But for a company that has sold itself as an unbiased news source for more than 40 years — to viewers, to advertisers, to cable or satellite operators — that presents a problem.

Since Licht took over, morning anchor Brianna Keilar's occasional takedowns of Fox coverage have disappeared. Although Licht hasn't commented publicly on Stelter's exit, the media reporter's criticism of Fox was a regular feature of “Reliable Sources.”

...

Licht has taken steps toward the goals his bosses have elucidated. He wants CNN anchors to be conscious of a perspective that they sometime talk down to people. He wants panel discussions to be informative, not dominated by extreme points of view. He wants to resist “outrage porn.” He ordered that the on-air “breaking news” banner be reserved for real breaking news.

...

Licht would like to see more Republicans appear on CNN for meaningful interviews, not necessarily to be used by them to appear tough to supporters for standing up to hostility. There have already been small signs of success in recent weeks: appearances by South Carolina Sen. Tim Scott and Texas U.S. Rep. Dan Crenshaw.

malchior wrote: ↑Thu May 11, 2023 9:40 amExactly and why I'm done with CNN. It's literally blocked in my home now. I will not give them a cent. I don't fund oppression. Here or anywhere.

Same. 100%. #boycottCNN

Exodor wrote: ↑Thu May 11, 2023 9:07 am

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Thu May 11, 2023 7:36 am Once you accept this was a ratings ploy by CNN, everything else makes sense. All the deep analysis is meaningless. They were hoping he'd act like a goon and drive eyeballs to their channel - that's it.

I guess it was kind of effective - for years CNN has been my go-to for web news. When I get on the PC each morning that's the first tab I hit.

This morning I'm looking for another landing page.


So congrats CNN, I guess?

I use Google News because it offers me a range of sources for any given major story -- CNN among them, but also The Guardian, AP, NYT, WaPo, Reuters....

Kurth wrote: ↑Thu May 11, 2023 11:13 am

malchior wrote: ↑Thu May 11, 2023 9:40 amExactly and why I'm done with CNN. It's literally blocked in my home now. I will not give them a cent. I don't fund oppression. Here or anywhere.

Same. 100%. #boycottCNN

Unless you completely cut the cord, you're giving them money every time you pay your cable bill.

pr0ner wrote: ↑Thu May 11, 2023 11:27 am

Kurth wrote: ↑Thu May 11, 2023 11:13 am

malchior wrote: ↑Thu May 11, 2023 9:40 amExactly and why I'm done with CNN. It's literally blocked in my home now. I will not give them a cent. I don't fund oppression. Here or anywhere.

Same. 100%. #boycottCNN

Unless you completely cut the cord, you're giving them money every time you pay your cable bill.

Sure, although I am planning to cut the cord this summer now that I can get NFL Sunday Ticket without putting a stupid satellite dish on my house.

Also, I don’t watch cable news or any news really on TV. So in terms of my active support of CNN, it really comes down to consuming their content online, which I used to do every day. No more.

GreenGoo wrote: ↑Thu May 11, 2023 7:29 am

Alefroth wrote: ↑Wed May 10, 2023 10:53 pm Curious how you propose that be done.

You cut his mic so he can't outshout his host, for one. Tell him at the beginning that things are going to be civil and if he can't be civil they'll turn him off when it's not his turn.

edit: Lol. Whoops. *shrug*

Who still thinks Trump can be bargained and reasoned with? If you're going to cut his mic, which you should know you'll need to do a lot, why even bother with the town hall. It's amazing people still think Trump is normal.

No one thinks he's normal. Normal people don't need to have their mic turned off.

People think they can make a pact with him. For all we know, they tried and he refused to appear if they did.

Alefroth wrote: ↑Thu May 11, 2023 2:56 pm People think they can make a pact with him. For all we know, they tried and he refused to appear if they did.

Who thinks this? Which people?

As far as my own comment goes. It wasn't a pact. It was telling him how it's going to be.

There are two things happening in this thread.

Some people talking about what to do once he's there, and others talking about never letting him in the front door. Talking hypothetically about the first does not mean they disagree with the second.

One has to wonder if TFG opened himself up to ANOTHER defamation lawsuit too..

E. Jean Carroll May Sue Trump a Third Time After ‘Vile’ Comments on CNN

In an interview, her lawyer said that the former president’s mocking comments in a town hall broadcast could create fresh legal jeopardy.

Interviewer should have asked him about Dominion and Smartmatic too...

When Trump called Collins “nasty” I wish she had said, “ I’m certain your sexual assault victims think you are nasty”.

That's his go to insult for women who stand up to him.

So apparently, the town hall got 3.1 million viewers which is less than the 3.7 million when Biden had a town hall on CNN, but Trump is going to call Nielson and ask them to find 800,000 more viewers.

GreenGoo wrote: ↑Thu May 11, 2023 7:47 am For today. Why they don't realize that their very existence is under threat by an authoritarian government, I have no idea. Russia's a role model, maybe?

Even an authoritarian government still need news media to spread their propaganda. I guess they think they'll just survive by spreading whatever the authoritarian government want them to spread.

Defiant wrote:So apparently, the town hall got 3.1 million viewers which is less than the 3.7 million when Biden had a town hall on CNN, but Trump is going to call Nielson and ask them to find 800,000 more viewers.

On brand, and funny.

I can only conclude the non-Fox, non-far right news networks like CNN( the mainstream media) want trump to win. They’ll never be able to have the same histrionics about anyone else.

Look at the late night news hosts, you’d think Trump was still in power.

I think that what was shocking for me was the cheering, neutrals will looks at this and say trump is popular. At the very least cnn handed him the Republican nomination and possibly a new term.

A Trump event packed with Trump cultists could turn into a GG Allin concert ending with Trump pissing and vomiting on the audience and they'd STILL love him. I swear to God, Hillary was right.

waitingtoconnect wrote: ↑Fri May 12, 2023 4:01 am I can only conclude the non-Fox, non-far right news networks like CNN( the mainstream media) want trump to win.

Of course they do. They get a ton of eyeballs when he's in the spotlight...country be damned.

This scolding we all got from Anderson Cooper last night was hilarious and pathetic.



Because the only two options available are to either "live in a silo" (can someone please find me that silo where I don't have to hear about Trump? Please??) or to dedicate our network to putting Trump on in center stage with a handpicked audience of MAGA chuds and a simpering moderator to let him simply firehose his lies and bullshit to the entire world for an hour. No other options. Nope.

Grow a fucking spine, man.

Yeah, I mean I think there are legitimate arguments to be had about the "right" way for the media to cover Trump's campaign. But clearly that Town Hall was the wrong thing to do.

There's the all too predictable arrogance I was talking about.

El Guapo wrote: ↑Fri May 12, 2023 9:01 am Yeah, I mean I think there are legitimate arguments to be had about the "right" way for the media to cover Trump's campaign. But clearly that Town Hall was the wrong thing to do.

Exactly. Josh Barro wrote something similar to Cooper in his newsletter yesterday. He was also arguing Americans don't need a media deciding what is good. That's not the point.

They don't get the threat or don't care.

The problem is holding a Town Hall as a campaign event, not an open forum or other way for other perspectives. Yes, the audience needs to engage with deplorables. But CNN shouldn’t be giving them preferential treatment.

Victoria Raverna wrote: ↑Thu May 11, 2023 10:12 pm Even an authoritarian government still need news media to spread their propaganda. I guess they think they'll just survive by spreading whatever the authoritarian government want them to spread.

If they think they are going to be beaten out by Fox or OAN they are delusional.

hepcat wrote: ↑Fri May 12, 2023 8:17 am A Trump event packed with Trump cultists could turn into a GG Allin concert ending with Trump pissing and vomiting on the audience and they'd STILL love him. I swear to God, Hillary was right.

Hillary absolutely was right. What I didn't understand at the time, was how many of them were out there.

Skinypupy wrote: ↑Fri May 12, 2023 8:38 am

waitingtoconnect wrote: ↑Fri May 12, 2023 4:01 am I can only conclude the non-Fox, non-far right news networks like CNN( the mainstream media) want trump to win.

Of course they do. They get a ton of eyeballs when he's in the spotlight...country be damned.

This scolding we all got from Anderson Cooper last night was hilarious and pathetic.



Because the only two options available are to either "live in a silo" (can someone please find me that silo where I don't have to hear about Trump? Please??) or to dedicate our network to putting Trump on in center stage with a handpicked audience of MAGA chuds and a simpering moderator to let him simply firehose his lies and bullshit to the entire world for an hour. No other options. Nope.

Grow a fucking spine, man.

As the Governator said a few days ago many so called liberals happily joined with the Nazis to propel them to power because they thought once in government and business with them we can control them.

GreenGoo wrote: ↑Fri May 12, 2023 9:45 am

hepcat wrote: ↑Fri May 12, 2023 8:17 am A Trump event packed with Trump cultists could turn into a GG Allin concert ending with Trump pissing and vomiting on the audience and they'd STILL love him. I swear to God, Hillary was right.

Hillary absolutely was right. What I didn't understand at the time, was how many of them were out there.

People have been weaponised and Fox propaganda has worked. Look at when Star Trek discovery launched around 2016 - trailers showed an Asian woman and a black woman in command. Racist “fans” went bonkers yet they never did for DS9 or Voyager in the 1990s when they had a black captain and a woman captain.

waitingtoconnect wrote: ↑Fri May 12, 2023 9:59 amPeople have been weaponised and Fox propaganda has worked. Look at when Star Trek discovery launched around 2016 - trailers showed an Asian woman and a black woman in command. Racist “fans” went bonkers yet they never did for DS9 or Voyager in the 1990s when they had a black captain and a woman captain.

As someone around at the time...they absolutely did. The difference is they didn't have highly accessible social media networks to find each other and amplify their voices. But I would agree the temperature has been turned up by Fox and right-wing grievance media.

This may have not been the win for Trump that many seem to think it is:

I dunno, we'll see. Ultimately I think the most consequential part of this Town Hall will be whether it's a one-off event, or whether it heralds a return by CNN to 2016-esque coverage of Trump.

Their event was the talk of the nation, and topped every headline for two days.

The CEO applauded it as a massive service to the country.

They will absolutely choose the path of ‘relevance’ and as has been stated many times, eyeballs/money….EVERY. Time.

That IS their job. To make as much money as possible for the $34B Warner Bros Discovery shareholders. Period. End of story.

Grifman wrote: ↑Fri May 12, 2023 11:59 am This may have not been the win for Trump that many seem to think it is:

Whether it's a win for him or not, it was a loss for your country, imo.

Carpet_pissr wrote: ↑Fri May 12, 2023 1:39 pm Their event was the talk of the nation, and topped every headline for two days.

The CEO applauded it as a massive service to the country.

They will absolutely choose the path of ‘relevance’ and as has been stated many times, eyeballs/money….EVERY. Time.

That IS their job. To make as much money as possible for the $34B Warner Bros Discovery shareholders. Period. End of story.

CNN is a corporate network that relies on eyeballs in hotel rooms. That audience is motivated by economic conditions and in their minds are thinking Trump is better for business. That Trump and co caused the current circumstances we are in isn't a factor in a world of quarter by quarter targets and stock prices. Big business is tired of the instability and would rather have stability under a Trump dictatorship than the current malaise.

Also tech donors who despite Elon Musk mostly pump money into the Democrats have less money while big resources donors have a lot of cash to splash and they prefer Republican.

I watch a lot of news, and in my opinion in this sphere at least Trump has already won. He is getting more airtime than any other candidate on every single non-Fox mainstream network including MSNBC. Biden gets so little airtime, the mainstream channels don't even have time to cover his scandals.

You would think Trump was still president.

He showed yet again at the Town Hall that he is the master at reality tv politics for which I believe the conventional system has no answer. These strategies are summarised in this article (https://slate.com/culture/2017/01/trump ... itics.html):

* Personal brawls as stand-ins for personal beliefs and policy (think a vote out based show like Survivor.
* Constant relitigation of ancient injuries (think Real Housewives...)
* Carefully cycling through scandals. In the aftermath of scandal, good reality personalities have to be already building toward the new fight. It doesn’t matter why you’re onscreen as long as you are onscreen, and reality-TV survival hinges on your ability to provide sufficiently entertaining material to the editors at regular, easily narrativized intervals.)

Rather than abandoning the tropes and techniques that got him to this point and taking up the usual mantle of presidential neutrality, Trump is still living inside the explosive part three of a reunion special, swearing to do good things in the future while screaming about media feuds on Twitter.

CNN rankings continue decline. I don't know if this is directly related to the disastrous townhall but hopefully they see it that way.

CNN prime time dropped on Friday to 335,000 average total viewers from 8 to 11 p.m, coming below right-wing channel Newsmax, which scored 357,000 average prime time viewers.

The ratings-beleaguered network landed in fourth place in prime time, also behind Fox News and MSNBC, which averaged 1.44 million and 1.08 million total average viewers in prime time — respectively.

malchior wrote: ↑Mon May 15, 2023 9:55 pm CNN rankings continue decline. I don't know if this is directly related to the disastrous townhall but hopefully they see it that way.

CNN prime time dropped on Friday to 335,000 average total viewers from 8 to 11 p.m, coming below right-wing channel Newsmax, which scored 357,000 average prime time viewers.

The ratings-beleaguered network landed in fourth place in prime time, also behind Fox News and MSNBC, which averaged 1.44 million and 1.08 million total average viewers in prime time — respectively.

Man, when you're losing to Newsmax . . . you've got issues. Good. I hope they choke on those terrible ratings.

Kurth wrote: ↑Mon May 15, 2023 11:18 pm Good. I hope they choke on those terrible ratings.

Same here.