Octopus Overlords

Might as well start this now and not use the new trek show thread since it isn't specific..it was for Discovery anyways I think.

The series follows Captain Christopher Pike and the crew of the starship USS Enterprise as they explore new worlds throughout the galaxy during the decade before Star Trek: The Original Series.

First art for it...

I'll resubscribe to Paramount when this hits. I think they already have a whole new season of Discovery that I haven't seen in the can.

I think this might be the best idea they've had in years.

I've been looking forward to complaining about this for a long time.

Anyway, I think Mount is a welcome addition to the franchise. I’m really looking forward to this. Paramount has mostly figured out the formula for Star Trek. Discovery has become a pretty good Star Trek show, as was Picard. But they’re both more TNG/DS9. It will be fun to have a TOS style entry.

Kraken wrote: ↑Tue Feb 01, 2022 8:30 pm I'll resubscribe to Paramount when this hits. I think they already have a whole new season of Discovery that I haven't seen in the can.

Only half a season right now - the second half of Season 4 starts up again on February 10.

Exodor wrote: ↑Tue Feb 01, 2022 11:19 pm

Kraken wrote: ↑Tue Feb 01, 2022 8:30 pm I'll resubscribe to Paramount when this hits. I think they already have a whole new season of Discovery that I haven't seen in the can.

Only half a season right now - the second half of Season 4 starts up again on February 10.

Thanks. I'm in no rush. I'll wait until they've built up a corpus that I can binge.

hepcat wrote: ↑Tue Feb 01, 2022 9:56 pm

Anyway, I think Mount is a welcome addition to the franchise. I’m really looking forward to this. Paramount has mostly figured out the formula for Star Trek. Discovery has become a pretty good Star Trek show, as was Picard. But they’re both more TNG/DS9. It will be fun to have a TOS style entry.

And he even had a connection to Trek long before being cast in Discovery by acting alongside Colm Meaney in Hell on Wheels. I agree, he's a great actor and I'm glad to see him get more work.

I like the end where everyone beams up...but Pike.

So they've announced the casting of James Kirk for season 2.

They just can't resist, can they? Why don't we just start modernizing the plots of old scripts and re-shoot those? (Yes, I know that's called a remake.)

It hasn't even started airing yet, has it? And they're already casting season 2. I really wish they'd just slow down a little and allow us a chance to breathe.

Sudy wrote: ↑Tue Mar 15, 2022 8:33 pm So they've announced the casting of James Kirk for season 2.

They just can't resist, can they? Why don't we just start modernizing the plots of old scripts and re-shoot those? (Yes, I know that's called a remake.).

I prefer to wait and see if it’s good before I declare a national emergency.

There is no world that requires three Kirks.

You’re right…it probably deserves four or five.

How many Spider-Mans are we up to now?

This is not a winnable argument for either side. There are many who are just as tired of Spider-Man (and Batman!) reboots (which have partially been done for the sake of retaining a license). The latest ones having been regarded as good has done something to ameliorate that stance. My perspective is that there's more to Star Trek than Kirk and Spock (and more to Star Wars than the Skywalkers, etc). The new show deserves space to breathe and be its own thing, at least for a time.

With you, it was never even going to be, that’s true.

Sudy wrote: ↑Tue Feb 01, 2022 9:25 pm I've been looking forward to complaining about this for a long time.

And I thought it wouldn't begin until at least the first episode aired.

hepcat wrote: ↑Tue Mar 15, 2022 9:05 pm You’re right…it probably deserves four or five.

How many Spider-Mans are we up to now?

At least those are different people.

Even if a multiverse has been established recently, there’s still decades of different people playing Peter Parker. Just like we now have different people playing Kirk…and Spock…and Dracula….and Hannibal Lecter….and Mark Wahlberg (there have been 5 of those, but no one has ever cared).

It is a pretty common name in the phone book. Whole spider powers thing would be a hell of a coincidence, though.

I’m betting I could find a James Kirk in a phone book too. But he probably won’t have spider powers.

Sudy wrote: ↑Tue Mar 15, 2022 9:34 pm And I thought it wouldn't begin until at least the first episode aired.

I knew you had it in you. I believe in you, man.

hepcat wrote: ↑Tue Mar 15, 2022 9:05 pm You’re right…it probably deserves four or five.

Well, it technically does have 3 up to now. TOS Original. 2009 Reboot Kirk, including Young Kirk) And now an additional Discoverse Kirk.

Btw, has anyone watched the Star Trek Continues fanfilm series? It's really quite excellent. Kirk's voice in that one is kind of mousy, but the amount of talent they attracted in that series was impressive, although short. They've got Lou Ferrigno as an Orion Pirate, Grant Imahara as Sulu, John DeLancie in a Non-Q role for once, Micheal Dorn and Marina Sirtis both as computer voices, and even Jason Isaacs doing some voice work, and I can't forget Colin Baker. The stories are all quite good. In their finale, they even bridge the gap between TOS and the movies.

https://www.youtube.com/c/StarTrekContinues

Seen a few eps. They even got the original Apollo from Who Mourns for Adonis to reprise his role before the actors death.

I'm not bothered by a new Kirk. I will say this, though - the Spider-Man/Batman comparison isn't a great one. Kirk was established as a real human being (in the form of Shatner.) His personality and mannerisms were defined by the actor. Comic book characters were established as art that the various actors have room to take their own spin on without having to worry about established personalitys. A slightly better example would be Bond (although he's literary, too, although much less read.) Maybe Obi-Wan Kenobi.

Anyway, I'm fine with it.

Rumpy wrote: ↑Tue Mar 15, 2022 11:42 pm

hepcat wrote: ↑Tue Mar 15, 2022 9:05 pm You’re right…it probably deserves four or five.

Well, it technically does have 3 up to now. TOS Original. 2009 Reboot Kirk, including Young Kirk) And now an additional Discoverse Kirk.

My hope is that he's just a minor character. Kirk only ever met Pike once in TOS, so he shouldn't have any relationship with Pike. Spock would be their only link, I believe. Well, that and the Enterprise herself...

...and bald super aliens.

Rumpy wrote: ↑Tue Mar 15, 2022 11:42 pm Discoverse Kirk.

Rumpy wrote: ↑Tue Mar 15, 2022 8:53 pm It hasn't even started airing yet, has it? And they're already casting season 2. I really wish they'd just slow down a little and allow us a chance to breathe.

Considering Season 4 of Star Trek Discovery started filming a full year before release, what else do you expect? Season 2 will likely start filming soon, and it's just a casting announcement, anyway.

Rumpy wrote: ↑Tue Mar 15, 2022 11:42 pm

hepcat wrote: ↑Tue Mar 15, 2022 9:05 pm You’re right…it probably deserves four or five.

Well, it technically does have 3 up to now. TOS Original. 2009 Reboot Kirk, including Young Kirk) And now an additional Discoverse Kirk.

Considering all Star Trek TV is canon, Kirk in Strange New Worlds is technically the same as TOS Original Kirk, just recast to fit the time the series takes place in.

hepcat wrote: ↑Wed Mar 16, 2022 10:44 am

Rumpy wrote: ↑Tue Mar 15, 2022 11:42 pm

hepcat wrote: ↑Tue Mar 15, 2022 9:05 pm You’re right…it probably deserves four or five.

Well, it technically does have 3 up to now. TOS Original. 2009 Reboot Kirk, including Young Kirk) And now an additional Discoverse Kirk.

My hope is that he's just a minor character. Kirk only ever met Pike once in TOS, so he shouldn't have any relationship with Pike. Spock would be their only link, I believe. Well, that and the Enterprise herself...

...and bald super aliens.

I would hope so. But they've already complicated things by showing Pike's fate in Discovery after their Talos IV visit. It makes the whole timeline of The Cage rather murky. The Discovery visit being the second visit, it makes me wonder how much time has passed between his first and second and when he gets his injury. Then you have the time between his injury and the time Kirk takes command of the Enterprise. It would seem to me that what they plan on doing here is to show Kirk being handed off command of the Enterprise and inheriting Spock. And if this is the second season, well that doesn't leave them all that much room for future seasons. How many years in command of the Enterprise does Kirk have when TOS airs its first episode?

pr0ner wrote: ↑Wed Mar 16, 2022 11:26 am

Rumpy wrote: ↑Tue Mar 15, 2022 8:53 pm It hasn't even started airing yet, has it? And they're already casting season 2. I really wish they'd just slow down a little and allow us a chance to breathe.

Considering Season 4 of Star Trek Discovery started filming a full year before release, what else do you expect? Season 2 will likely start filming soon, and it's just a casting announcement, anyway.

I expect them to wait for the first season to have aired to announce it. They don't know how well SNW will do. This is like announcing the winner of a horse race before the horses have even left their gates. Waiting until after the first season is finished would make people appreciate the series more and possibly want more.

Considering all Star Trek TV is canon, Kirk in Strange New Worlds is technically the same as TOS Original Kirk, just recast to fit the time the series takes place in.

But we're discussing the different actor interpretations, aren't we? I don't think anyone is arguing against whether they're the same character. Yes, they're the same character, but they're all rather different interpretations of him.

Blackhawk wrote: ↑Wed Mar 16, 2022 10:07 am Maybe Obi-Wan Kenobi.

Anyway, I'm fine with it.

I actually think a more apt comparison would be Han Solo given how protective Harrison Ford has been of the character. Obi-Wan isn't quite the same thing given that they had to recast him as part of the prequel trilogy, and it was always going to be an expected move. But Solo on the other hand, was never expected to be performed by anyone other than Harrison Ford, until they had to cast a younger actor in the role for Solo, a movie outside the Skywalker saga..

For point 1, Strange New Worlds Season 2 is already filming (I was wrong there). Shows get renewed early all the time. This is not unique to Star Trek.

For point 2, I don't think the discussion is just different actor interpretations. The different versions of Spider-Man or Batman tend to be in different universes/timelines (hence why Michael Keaton and Ben Affleck are getting brought back for The Flash or Batgirl), too, to go along with different actors.

I thought about mentioning the timelines given that there's an entire debate surrounding that, but in the end I didn't. We could go around in circles with that one.

pr0ner wrote: ↑Wed Mar 16, 2022 1:36 pm The different versions of Spider-Man or Batman tend to be in different universes/timelines (hence why Michael Keaton and Ben Affleck are getting brought back for The Flash or Batgirl), too, to go along with different actors.

To be fair, that's a fairly recent development in the cinematic universe.

I dont mind knowing. And from his picture his physical look is a great fit for Kirk of that time. I think Bill is too old to play himself.

Daehawk wrote: ↑Thu Mar 17, 2022 12:10 pm I think Bill is too old to play himself.

That goes without saying... I'm just surprised they're resorting to Kirk as early as the second season. They realistically didn't even need to introduce Kirk into the series. Now it just makes me wonder if they're maybe painting themselves into a corner.

What I'm hoping for is perhaps a framing device. TOS era Spock serving with Kirk and then remembering his adventures with Pike. Although that could get old pretty fast too.

These days every show or movie has to reference familiar characters so we can all collectively do this:

I think that's true of any show/franchise that has been around as long as this.

It boggles my mind that Star Trek is seeing such a resurgence 5 decades after it first premiered. Here's to 5 more!

hepcat wrote: ↑Thu Mar 17, 2022 1:14 pm What I'm hoping for is perhaps a framing device. TOS era Spock serving with Kirk and then remembering his adventures with Pike. Although that could get old pretty fast too.

Yeah, a framing device could work. Being that this series in serial in nature, it's possible he only appears in one episode too. That's something I keep forgetting. Still, I'd expect this kind of thing near the end of a series run, not the beginning. And introducing such a familiar character comes across feeling (at least to me) like Paramount doesn't completely trust the show to stand on its own merits without namedropping a popular character to draw in subscriptions. And I wish these shows could just stand on their own merits for once. But there's no doubt in my mind that this was a Paramount decision, not a showrunner decision.

To me, it almost feels like the decision to have Riker and Troi in Enterprise's finale, which was frame around that one particular TNG episode.

Just had this crazy wild thought. What if they're doing a retelling of The Managerie from Pike's point of view?? The original one was from Kirk's point of view, if I remember correctly.

I want one from Pike's chair's point of view....

...too soon?

Heh, good one, Hep! Took me a sec, but I got it