Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

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Smoove_B
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by Smoove_B »

Skinypupy wrote: Tue Aug 02, 2022 5:30 pm First it was Secret Service, then broader DHS, and now we find out that the Pentagon also wiped the phones of Trump officials and deleted Jan 6 texts. It’s just so weird how this keeps happening over and over again, right?

I fully expect the “BUT HER E-MAILS” crowd to be demanding answers and accountability.
I guess it could be two things. First the obvious - corruption top to bottom, which is terrifying. Specifically that multiple agencies attempted to cover up a coup.

The second is that perhaps the DoD recognized the threat to national security (if it got out that there were bad actors in the Secret Service and DHS) so they made sure that information couldn't get out and potentially threaten our international standing.

Neither one is good, quite frankly as we continue to hit the guardrails at full speed.
Maybe next year, maybe no go
malchior
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by malchior »

It is at the point that we should be concerned that there was a concerted effort to cover up what happened. We have no proof of it but this pattern is just ridiculous. Three agencies (and counting) saw key personnel swapped out by Trump after the election. Then those agencies apparently broke the law and destroyed key records for people involved with 1/6. This is turning out to look like a huge crime spree by our government. Unfortunately the cops know if it is as bad as it looks and they expose the truth then their own institutions will be shown to be smack dab in the middle of it. We're all on our own in many ways. Keep preparing.
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hepcat
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by hepcat »

I’m not saying it’s true, but couldn’t it just be gross incompetence by government IT departments/contractors?

Believe me, I’m no supporter of anything even remotely Trump related, but I do see this level of idiocy in IT departments quite a bit.
Covfefe!
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gbasden
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by gbasden »

hepcat wrote: Tue Aug 02, 2022 8:23 pm I’m not saying it’s true, but couldn’t it just be gross incompetence by government IT departments/contractors?

Believe me, I’m no supporter of anything even remotely Trump related, but I do see this level of idiocy in IT departments quite a bit.
I can totally accept incompetence and bungling in government agencies, but it strains credibility that it happened to three different ones right after the biggest insurrection in modern American history.
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by malchior »

And many of the people involved were installed by Trump after the election. And the Secret Service device refresh plan was created in December after the election.
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by LawBeefaroni »

hepcat wrote: Tue Aug 02, 2022 8:23 pm I’m not saying it’s true, but couldn’t it just be gross incompetence by government IT departments/contractors?

Believe me, I’m no supporter of anything even remotely Trump related, but I do see this level of idiocy in IT departments quite a bit.
The kind of incompetence that would accidentally wipe government communications records wouldn't be able to completely wipe those records. There is clear intent to cover up whatever communications were exchanged.
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by em2nought »

Maybe they learned from the bestest :D

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Technically, he shouldn't be here.
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

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:sleeping-yellow:
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pr0ner
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by pr0ner »

Because Alex Jones' attorneys screwed up BIGLY in the damages portion of his current ongoing defamation lawsuits with Sandy Hook parents, this has happened.

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Pyperkub
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by Pyperkub »

pr0ner wrote:Because Alex Jones' attorneys screwed up BIGLY in the damages portion of his current ongoing defamation lawsuits with Sandy Hook parents, this has happened.

They also screwed up bigly in, oh, defaulting on the initial Defamation lawsuit.

This is just the damages portion.
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by pr0ner »

Pyperkub wrote: Wed Aug 03, 2022 3:20 pm This is just the damages portion.
I know, that's in my post that you quoted. :lol:
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naednek
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by naednek »

gbasden wrote: Wed Aug 03, 2022 3:44 am
hepcat wrote: Tue Aug 02, 2022 8:23 pm I’m not saying it’s true, but couldn’t it just be gross incompetence by government IT departments/contractors?

Believe me, I’m no supporter of anything even remotely Trump related, but I do see this level of idiocy in IT departments quite a bit.
I can totally accept incompetence and bungling in government agencies, but it strains credibility that it happened to three different ones right after the biggest insurrection in modern American history.
Watch it :P
hepcat - "I agree with Naednek"
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gbasden
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by gbasden »

naednek wrote: Thu Aug 04, 2022 1:04 am
gbasden wrote: Wed Aug 03, 2022 3:44 am
hepcat wrote: Tue Aug 02, 2022 8:23 pm I’m not saying it’s true, but couldn’t it just be gross incompetence by government IT departments/contractors?

Believe me, I’m no supporter of anything even remotely Trump related, but I do see this level of idiocy in IT departments quite a bit.
I can totally accept incompetence and bungling in government agencies, but it strains credibility that it happened to three different ones right after the biggest insurrection in modern American history.
Watch it :P
Hey, ARB is a model of efficacy and diligence! I was referring to those ... other... government types. :)
malchior
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by malchior »

Thankfully we don't have our own examples of major events where that last sentence applied.

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Smoove_B
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by Smoove_B »

Again, more support for my belief that these people need to hang:
Some users on pro-Trump internet forums told users to “lock and load,” agitated for civil war and urged protesters to head to Mar-a-Lago in the hours after news broke that former President Donald Trump’s Florida compound was searched by the FBI on Monday.

One user posting about the “civil war” shortly after the search was Tyler Welsh Slaeker, a Washington man awaiting sentencing for storming the Capitol on Jan. 6, 2021, according to previous research and statements posted online. A December report by Advance Democracy, a nonpartisan investigative nonprofit, found that Slaeker posted to the pro-Trump internet forum TheDonald, under the username “bananaguard62.”

On Monday night, the username “bananaguard62,” posted the top reply to the “lock and load” post.

“Are we not in a cold civil war at this point?” the account asked. Another user responded, “several points ago.” Another top reply to Slaeker quoted a notorious antisemitic, Nazi rallying cry
There is a subset of these people that are itching to do it all over again and the next time, they're not going to half-ass it.
Maybe next year, maybe no go
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El Guapo
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by El Guapo »

Smoove_B wrote: Tue Aug 09, 2022 4:45 pm
One user posting about the “civil war” shortly after the search was Tyler Welsh Slaeker, a Washington man awaiting sentencing for storming the Capitol on Jan. 6, 2021, according to previous research and statements posted online. A December report by Advance Democracy, a nonpartisan investigative nonprofit, found that Slaeker posted to the pro-Trump internet forum TheDonald, under the username “bananaguard62.”
Can I buy a drink for Mr. Slaeker's lawyer?
Black Lives Matter.
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Isgrimnur
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by Isgrimnur »

He probably has plenty.
It's almost as if people are the problem.
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by Blackhawk »

They're going to... storm Mar-a-Lago? Hours after the search was over and the FBI left?

Good plan. Go with that. Occupy Mar-a-Lago!
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by Carpet_pissr »

Step 1. Descend upon our Master’s lair to protect it and him
Step 2. ….??!
Step 3. Out of confusion about what the plan is (and itchiness to DO something) start looting and breaking shit. Maybe fire off a few rounds.
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Grifman
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

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Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions. – G.K. Chesterton
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Grifman
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by Grifman »

They are terrorists after all:

Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions. – G.K. Chesterton
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Jaymann
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by Jaymann »

Because nothing says fair treatment like the smiling faces at Guantanamo Bay.

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Kraken
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by Kraken »

Yeah, Gitmo is a regular Club Fed.

I realize they're just posturing.
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by Carpet_pissr »

Send them to Russian Penal Colony #2.
malchior
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by malchior »

Meanwhile, the testimony in the Oath Keepers trial really makes it look like we should be investigating potential major problems with the FBI and Secret Service.



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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by Isgrimnur »

Well, I hope she enjoyed the Ren Faire.
It's almost as if people are the problem.
malchior
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by malchior »

The jury hung on two charges. One was that she "aided and abetted" the theft of Pelosi's laptop.
Last edited by malchior on Mon Nov 21, 2022 5:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by Isgrimnur »

Politico
Williams’ lawyers portrayed her as a naive “girl,” with no knowledge of Congress’ proceedings and no intent to harm Pelosi or anyone else in the Capitol, and who initially believed she had breached the White House. Williams lied to friends about stealing items from Pelosi’s office, like a gavel and a laptop, defense attorney Lori Ulrich said, deciding to inflate her involvement in events, only to reverse course when she realized she was in serious legal trouble.
...
But prosecutors said Williams didn’t need to show up armed to commit the crimes she’s charged with. Rather, she jumped at the chance to join the mob breaching the Capitol, urged rioters to “take that fucking laptop” from Pelosi’s office, and counseled one to “put on gloves” as he tried to remove it.
It's almost as if people are the problem.
malchior
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by malchior »

Reports are saying she didn't know she'd be taken into custody for her felony convictions and was upset. Whoops! The 'finding out' after 'fucking around' can be jarring.
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

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Nothing she can do about it now - the judge has banged his gravel hammwr tbing.
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malchior
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by malchior »

NY Times

The Oathkeepers trial verdicts just came in and one legal analyst just described these verdicts as "all over the place". The members were all convicted of at least one crime but all were also found not guilty on at least one charge. Rhodes for instance was found guilty of seditious conspiracy but not guilty on conspiracy to obstruct an official proceeding. Still it was a strong outcome internal logic be damned. :)
Stewart Rhodes, the leader of the far-right Oath Keepers militia, and one of his subordinates were convicted on Tuesday of seditious conspiracy as a jury found them guilty of seeking to keep former President Donald J. Trump in power through a plot that started after the 2020 election and culminated in the mob attack on the Capitol.

But the jury in Federal District Court in Washington found three other defendants in the case not guilty of sedition and acquitted Mr. Rhodes of two separate conspiracy charges.

The split verdicts, coming after three days of deliberations, were nonetheless a victory for the Justice Department and the first time in nearly 20 trials related to the Capitol attack that a jury decided that the violence that erupted on Jan. 6, 2021, was the product of an organized conspiracy.

Seditious conspiracy is the most serious charge brought so far in any of the 900 criminal cases stemming from the vast investigation of the Capitol attack, an inquiry that could still result in scores, if not hundreds, of additional arrests. It carries a maximum penalty of 20 years in prison.
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

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Second Judge rules that Trump can be held liable as it was outside his purview...
It goes to a question that has plagued the cases since they were filed: Did Trump go so far in the run-up to January 6 and after that the normal protections that cover the President, and other government workers, no longer apply?

One other judge, U.S. District Judge Amit Mehta for the District of Columbia, already ruled earlier this year that Trump had to face civil lawsuits over the insurrection attempt. Trump appealed that ruling, which is currently before the D.C. Circuit.

The suit before Sullivan accuses Trump of trying to disenfranchise voters by conspiring to overturn the 2020 election.

“Immunity does not protect acts that Former President Trump undertook outside the outer perimeter of his official duties,” Sullivan wrote in his Monday ruling.

He added, citing rulings in other civil rights cases brought against Trump for the election subversion efforts, that “there is no immunity defense for Former President Trump for ‘unofficial acts’ which ‘entirely concern his efforts to remain in office for a second term.'”

Sullivan added that part of the reason why the groups could proceed with their lawsuits is because Trump remains an active threat. Not only does he continue to lie about the 2020 and 2022 elections, Sullivan wrote, but he’s reveling in doing so.
Black Lives definitely Matter Lorini!

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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

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Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions. – G.K. Chesterton
malchior
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by malchior »

Inside DHS, the young analyst led the charge to activate the mechanism put in place to share critical intelligence among agencies. That person's attempts to sound the alarm were shut down, delayed or flat-out rejected at every turn, according to the analyst’s written account provided to inspector general investigators and an unredacted version of that final investigative report and other materials obtained by Yahoo News.

These systematic failures in the run-up to Jan. 6, 2021, raise questions about DHS’s ability to fulfill its core mission and about the future of its Office of Intelligence and Analysis, now helmed by Undersecretary Ken Wainstein. He testified Tuesday morning before the House Homeland Security Committee, his first public hearing since being confirmed by the Senate in June. (On Nov. 30, Wainstein testified before the Senate in a classified hearing.
"Systemic failures". Utter bullshit. This guy was sending reports up the chain to people. People ignored the warnings. Not a system. Not some nameless bureaucracy. People. Were they political appointees? Were they career people? Were they held to account for their failures?

Not to say complexity in security operations isn't a thing but what I'm seeing in this piece is a standard fall back to blaming bad process and absolving people when someone in charge should have picked up a phone and escalated it or went around the bureaucracy after weeks of waiting for the "report" that gummed up the entire process.
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El Guapo
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by El Guapo »

malchior wrote: Fri Dec 16, 2022 1:06 am
Inside DHS, the young analyst led the charge to activate the mechanism put in place to share critical intelligence among agencies. That person's attempts to sound the alarm were shut down, delayed or flat-out rejected at every turn, according to the analyst’s written account provided to inspector general investigators and an unredacted version of that final investigative report and other materials obtained by Yahoo News.

These systematic failures in the run-up to Jan. 6, 2021, raise questions about DHS’s ability to fulfill its core mission and about the future of its Office of Intelligence and Analysis, now helmed by Undersecretary Ken Wainstein. He testified Tuesday morning before the House Homeland Security Committee, his first public hearing since being confirmed by the Senate in June. (On Nov. 30, Wainstein testified before the Senate in a classified hearing.
"Systemic failures". Utter bullshit. This guy was sending reports up the chain to people. People ignored the warnings. Not a system. Not some nameless bureaucracy. People. Were they political appointees? Were they career people? Were they held to account for their failures?

Not to say complexity in security operations isn't a thing but what I'm seeing in this piece is a standard fall back to blaming bad process and absolving people when someone in charge should have picked up a phone and escalated it or went around the bureaucracy after weeks of waiting for the "report" that gummed up the entire process.
Yeah, like it shouldn't be forgotten that DHS is reporting to the president who is trying to overthrow the system on January 6th. The OBVIOUS questions are not "gee, what can we learn about better processes here?" but "was this ignored on purpose by DHS leaders who were either supportive of the aim or afraid of the president?"
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by Holman »

Am I wrong in remembering that DHS under Trump had been staffed and rewarded for enforcing his attitudes towards immigrants, and that long before the election there were indications that Trump viewed them as his loyal presidential armed force?
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Grifman
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

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Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions. – G.K. Chesterton
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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by Pyperkub »

Holman wrote:Am I wrong in remembering that DHS under Trump had been staffed and rewarded for enforcing his attitudes towards immigrants, and that long before the election there were indications that Trump viewed them as his loyal presidential armed force?
I think there was also a resignation/firing at the top and the leadership was interim. I might not have the timeline right tho

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Black Lives definitely Matter Lorini!

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Re: Capitol Riot Investigation Thread

Post by Isgrimnur »

John F. Kelly - 192 days
Elaine Duke (acting) - 128 days
Kirstjen Nielsen - 1 year, 125 days
Kevin McAleenan (acting) 217 days
Chad Wolf (acting) 1 year, 59 days
Pete Gaynor (acting) 9 days
It's almost as if people are the problem.
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