Octopus Overlords

Jaymann wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 12:40 pm I saw a post saying that a mask on a plane is a good idea even in a non-Covid era.

Jaymann wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 12:40 pm I saw a post saying that a mask on a plane is a good idea even in a non-Covid era.

LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 12:44 pm

Jaymann wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 12:40 pm I saw a post saying that a mask on a plane is a good idea even in a non-Covid era.

Except if you are seen trying to avoid common plane gunk or con sickness, you will be branded as mask-dependent and chastised for your addiction.

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 12:59 pm If I was the parent of an 8 or 5 year old right now, I'd feel completely abandoned.

New Jersey will still require all people — vaccinated or not — to wear masks indoors in public to protect against the coronavirus, Gov. Phil Murphy said Friday, even after federal health officials released updated guidance Thursday that says masks are not needed for fully vaccinated Americans in most circumstances.

But those who are fully vaccinated in the Garden State no longer need to wear a mask outside, Murphy said. Those who aren’t vaccinated still need to wear masks when in “close proximity” to others, he said.

El Guapo wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 3:06 pm FWIW a bunch of large chains (Target, Walgreen's, etc.) have already said that they're going to retain their mask requirements.

raydude wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 1:17 pm

LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 12:44 pm

Jaymann wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 12:40 pm I saw a post saying that a mask on a plane is a good idea even in a non-Covid era.

Except if you are seen trying to avoid common plane gunk or con sickness, you will be branded as mask-dependent and chastised for your addiction.

Speaking as one who never cared what strangers thought that's fine by me.

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 3:19 pm

El Guapo wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 3:06 pm FWIW a bunch of large chains (Target, Walgreen's, etc.) have already said that they're going to retain their mask requirements.

It would not surprise me to learn large retail corporations lobbied our governor last night to keep the mask mandate in effect for a little longer.

Kurth wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 4:04 pm I’m really happy to see the CDC conform their recommendations about masks and vaccinated individuals to the science. That said, I feel like we’re ostriches with our head in the sand to think that those adverse to masks are necessarily going to be truthful about their vaccination status.

I don’t see how we remove the indoor mask mandates without coupling that to a requirement (with an enforcement mechanism) that you be able to show that you were vaccinated.

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 10:36 am I'd expect this story to be a prominent feature of Fox News all day today.:

Pelosi keeps mask mandate on House floor despite CDC change, sparking GOP backlash: "It’s about control"

“You would hope that science would guide them to protect themselves, their family members and be good colleagues in the workplace to get vaccinated,” Pelosi said last month. “And the sooner that happens, the better for everything.”

Kurth wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 4:18 pm Also, couldn’t she just change the rule to conform to the new CDC guidelines and lift the mask mandate for vaccinated members?

ImLawBoy wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 4:55 pm

Kurth wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 4:18 pm Also, couldn’t she just change the rule to conform to the new CDC guidelines and lift the mask mandate for vaccinated members?

That's exactly what she should do. Then when Greene or another of Idiot Caucus shows up without a mask, make a big deal out of how she must be vaccinated because she's not wearing a mask.

Kraken wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 3:20 pm I would like to continue avoiding those maladies and will most likely mask up again next flu season, regardless of where we are with covid.

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 5:14 pm Forcing them to reveal their vaccination status violates HIPAA! (it doesn't)

So, here's what NJ avoided today by making the call to still wear masks indoors.

Next, go online and see what people are saying on social media about Trader Joe's or any number of other businesses and their mask/ non mask policies based on the CDC guidance.

Chaos, the answer is chaos.

Blackhawk wrote: ↑Sat May 15, 2021 9:05 am I don't know how things are in non third-world states, but from what I have seen, whether or not stores keep mandates or not is irrelevant. People who don't want to wear masks aren't going to wear them regardless of what the sign on the door says, and the stores have no way of even arguing with them.

Likewise the idea of confirming vaccination status to allow people to unmask indoors. Who is going to be checking, and who is going to be enforcing it?

Masking indoors has been voluntary since day one in 90% of stores because there is no way to force the issue if people ignore it.

LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Sat May 15, 2021 9:23 am

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Fri May 14, 2021 5:14 pm Forcing them to reveal their vaccination status violates HIPAA! (it doesn't)

So, here's what NJ avoided today by making the call to still wear masks indoors.

Next, go online and see what people are saying on social media about Trader Joe's or any number of other businesses and their mask/ non mask policies based on the CDC guidance.

Chaos, the answer is chaos.

There is no way they will be able to enforce the "you can go maskless if you are vaccinated" rules. It basically becomes "don't wear a mask if you don't want to." Counting on the honesty and civic sacrifice of people in America today is pure folly.

People should have complete information and be empowered to make their own decisions about how to address this small risk after being fully vaccinated, perhaps with the additional second layer of protection that masks afford. With the new announcement, every breakthrough infection that occurs will undermine CDC's message that if you are vaccinated, it is completely safe to remove your mask. The new guidance was too certain and too declarative to be a public health message we can take to the bank.

...

Fifth, the public health message would have been much stronger if it had been tied to a specific milestone. For instance, elsewhere, we've argued that by July 4 it is vital to get the number of Covid deaths in the US down to a level that is on par with influenza (as an interim milestone). A much more powerful and effective message would have been for the CDC to assert that if, for instance, daily Covid-19 deaths get to 50 to 100 per day, then some precautionary mandates will be lifted. Now, the collective incentive to achieve such milestones is largely lost. The current number of deaths is about 600 per day.

...

The way the CDC unveiled this message, it can't easily be undone. If the pandemic gets even worse, this will be a hard policy to reverse. We hope the US can continue to make progress on Covid-19 prevention and treatment, but it will have to be done despite this messaging but not because of it. Much work remains to be done to improve vaccination uptake, continued use of other non-pharmaceutical interventions, and achieve better access to treatment so as to truly lower Covid-19 cases and deaths and do so in an equitable manner. The fastest way there is not by discarding safety measures.

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Sat May 15, 2021 11:47 am based on some behind the curtain metric that I still haven't seen quantified. I'm assuming it's tied to the number of people that have at least one shot, but I don't know

It's a move the agency said was driven by scientific evidence that the vaccines play a major role in curbing both infections and transmission of the virus.

In announcing the agency's updated guidelines, CDC Director Dr. Rochelle Walensky said there are "numerous reports in the literature" to demonstrate the safety and real-world effectiveness of Covid-19 vaccines.

Kraken wrote: ↑Sat May 15, 2021 11:13 am It dawns on me that when I wear a mask when it's not required, as I did while walking through our town square today, I am unintentionally signalling that I'm not vaccinated. I'm not real happy about that.

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Sat May 15, 2021 11:47 am the pandemic is over.

Alefroth wrote:

Kraken wrote: ↑Sat May 15, 2021 11:13 am It dawns on me that when I wear a mask when it's not required, as I did while walking through our town square today, I am unintentionally signalling that I'm not vaccinated. I'm not real happy about that.

I'm just going to tell people I have tuberculosis.

The survey of 1,561 U.S. adults, which was conducted from May 11 to 13, found that in the week immediately prior to Thursday’s announcement, nearly two-thirds of Americans were still saying they wore a mask outside in public “always” (39 percent) or “most of the time” (24 percent) — and the numbers among vaccinated Americans were even higher, at 42 percent and 27 percent, respectively.

Now that moment has arrived, and frequent mask wearers say it is significantly more likely than any other milestone — such as “waiting until more people in my community are fully vaccinated” (25 percent) or “waiting until there are no COVID-19 cases in my community” (21 percent) — to convince them to lower their face coverings. A full 45 percent of Democrats who wear masks all or most of the time, for instance, said they would stop whenever the CDC gave them permission to do so.