[TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

[Rumpy]

This is a good video:

[Daehawk]

Manu....who plays Hugh..follows me on Twitter. He is a nice guy.

[Daehawk]

Full deal

[Sudy]

This is bloody amazing. Browse the bridges of Enterprises etc. in 3D:

https://roddenberry.x.io/2151-enterprise-nx-01/

Not that you can enter manual exploration mode by clicking stuff.

The Enterprise C is so disappointing. (But looks exactly like it did in that episode of TNG.)

[Rumpy]

Keep in mind that the exploration mode only works on Chrome, Edge, and perhaps Safari on a Mac, not Firefox. But when it does work, it's very impressive.

[hepcat]

If there's anything to be learned from those 3D views of starship bridges over the course of a few centuries, it's that chair technology is the only thing that has actually gone backwards.

Also, the original artwork for the bridge of the XCV-330 is vaguely reminiscent of any bachelor pad on a sitcom from the late 60's/early 70's about a single guy/father.

[Fireball]

Keep in mind that the exploration mode only works on Chrome, Edge, and perhaps Safari on a Mac, not Firefox. But when it does work, it's very impressive.

Works great in Safari on Mac.

[Fireball]

This is bloody amazing. Browse the bridges of Enterprises etc. in 3D:

https://roddenberry.x.io/2151-enterprise-nx-01/

Not that you can enter manual exploration mode by clicking stuff.

The Enterprise C is so disappointing. (But looks exactly like it did in that episode of TNG.)

I'm always struck by what a busy, crowded and unimpressive space the Enterprise E bridge is.

[Rumpy]

Yeah, IMHO, the E is where I feel there was a beginning in the decline of overall bridge design. You look at the original Enterprise, you know what it is, same with the Enterprise-D. They're both very distinctive in their own ways. But when I look at the Enterprise-E's bridge, it's a bit more generic feeling, and every other bridge following that seem to follow similar design guidelines. It looks a little too utilitarian? It looks like it serves a function, but that's it. It doesn't really evoke an emotion, doesn't really feel like it has much personality.

Btw, I visited James Cawley's TOS set in Ticonderoga several years ago. I totally nerded out that day, though my tour guide was wearing a TNG uniform which dispelled the illusion a bit. But it was impressive how detailed it was, down to even how it was originally laid out at Desilu Studios. It's interesting because everything had a logical flow to it. The original set designers must have put a lot of thought into their set in relation to the overall ship design as it would appear on screen.

Amusing thing is that Cawley is also an Elvis impersonator, and he put in an easter egg of his own on the set in the form of emergency procedures, which if you look closely, are actually the lyrics to Blue Suede Shoes.

[Daehawk]

[Rumpy]

I would say Trek by far. It's had more years of experience.

[Isgrimnur]

Up until midichlorians, Star Wars didn’t bother to try and explain anything.

[Defiant]

So I binged the final season of Picard.

Spoiler:

There was great chemistry, acting, humor by the Enterprise crew, and even the new people worked well. I had some issues with the storyline and the Borg+changling plot, but I was able to overlook them. And while the amount of fanservice was a bit much (I wouldn't have randomly thrown in Moriarty, for example, although other stuff, like making Shelby Fleet Captain, fit in fine). I liked having Ro back, although I wish it had been for longer than just a single episode (I guess maybe the actress didn't want to do any more?). Also the Data gave Lore his memories, turning him into him, felt stupid to me - I would have just had them reach some agreement to merge together or something (which is effectively what happens, anyway). Also, I, for one, was one of those people that thought the Enterprise D looked ugly compared to the other ships, so I'm not surprised it wasn't a popular souvenir.

Also, if Jack grew up on Earth, was Crusher also on Earth during most of that time? I mean, she was very protective of him, and yet it would be odd that no one knew where she was if she was on Earth. And I'm surprised that Picard would have been unaware that Ro was in starfleet. And that he hasn't even seen Worf in over a decade.

Also, I'm disturbed by the amount of nepotism of giving Jack a high level officer position one year after he had pretty much no training (maybe he got some experience from his time with his mother, but still...). And, add to that, let's not forget that if not for his actions in episode 9,a lot of lives might have been saved

Edit to add: was it just me or did parts of the climax of this season have some similarity to the climax of Prodigy? Been a while since I watched it, but IIRC, it had some similarity, where all federation starships, except for the Prodigy, were vulnerable to whatever it was.

[Rumpy]

Exactly, and I'd say it's not what I'd call such a complex universe. Sometimes it's best to keep things simple. The difference is that Trek being both a series of TV series and movies, it's literally got decades to build upon. Up until the Prequels, Star Wars didn't have much canon and only books to sate the appetite. There's also another difference in that SW really is more of a fantasy series set in Space rather than much of sci-fi with sciency things.

Oh and regarding Picard S3: with all of the nostalgia going on, yeah, it is a bit much at times, but I still feel that if they had done this from the start, they could have spread it out a bit more. It felt like they were playing catchup this season.

[Defiant]

[Defiant]

Oh, agreed. Season 3 should have been season 1 of Picard, and they should have reduced the number of plot lines and fan service and saved some of them for a second season, rather than cram them all into one season.

[Daehawk]

[Rumpy]

Oh, agreed. Season 3 should have been season 1 of Picard, and they should have reduced the number of plot lines and fan service and saved some of them for a second season, rather than cram them all into one season.

It's too bad that it was realized too late. But on the other hand, I think what Terry Matalas managed to do was amazing. He really tapped into it, and I read an article that said he managed to do the impossible by drastically improving it, including the ratings. The article mentioned that no show has had such a turnaround in TV history. I wish I could find the article now. The 3rd season managed to make me feel giddy about Trek again.

Oh here we go:
https://www.theringer.com/tv/2023/4/21/ ... turnaround

Long article, but well worth the read.

[Daehawk]

Jeri is a simple woman. So easy to please.

[Defiant]

Oh here we go:
https://www.theringer.com/tv/2023/4/21/ ... turnaround

Long article, but well worth the read.

Haven't finished reading, but while it's an interesting read, I'd point out that imdb ratings aren't the most objective measure - recent shows probably have more of a skew to them (both for good and bad) than older shows. Personally, I'd say in terms of quality the original TNG saw a much more steep turnaround between it's first couple of seasons (which for the most part had some really poor writing and a writers strike) and it's later seasons than Picard has.

[Rumpy]

Well of course, not everything is perfect, but I think that if you were to observe other metrics , you'd see much of the same thing. Just so happens that IMDB is one of the more accessible methods. Still, Picard only had 3 seasons to improve. To improve as much as it did, while it embraced nostalgia, is proof positive that something needed to happen. In contrast, TNG had time to improve on its own merits, something Picard did not.

[Fireball]

Oh, agreed. Season 3 should have been season 1 of Picard, and they should have reduced the number of plot lines and fan service and saved some of them for a second season, rather than cram them all into one season.

I disagree with this. You can't really do the reunion season until the last one, otherwise why not just make TNG seasons 8, 9, and 10? While the second season of Picard was a complete disaster, the first one was pretty good, and I liked several of the new characters, particularly Elnor. I wish he'd been in season 3.

[Fireball]

So I binged the final season of Picard.

Spoiler:

And I'm surprised that Picard would have been unaware that Ro was in starfleet.

Spoiler:

Prior to 2400, Picard had been in a personal cold war with Starfleet Command for more than 15 years. I don't think he was getting regular updates on who was or wasn't being brought back into the officer corps.

Spoiler:

Edit to add: was it just me or did parts of the climax of this season have some similarity to the climax of Prodigy? Been a while since I watched it, but IIRC, it had some similarity, where all federation starships, except for the Prodigy, were vulnerable to whatever it was.

Spoiler:

Yes. This is actually the second time this has happened with this show: the first season's artificial life wanting to wipe out biological life turn at the end was very similar to Control in season 2 of Discovery. The new Trek shows are poorly coordinated. While I love a lot of the new stuff, Kurtzman is a hack.

[hepcat]

I think there are some writers that are fantastic...but that shouldn't be working on certain properties.

For example: I'm a huge fan of Bryan Fuller. Hannibal, Pushing Daisies and Wonderfalls....all amazing television that elevated the medium over almost everything else that was on the air at the time.

But his direction for Star Trek: Discovery was a misfire from the moment they tried to reinvent the Klingons. Thankfully, someone realized that he wasn't really the person for the job and they rapidly back peddled in season 2 on many of the things Fuller wanted.

That doesn't mean Fuller's a bad writer. It just means that he wasn't able to see Star Trek for what it means to people in the context of its long history. He saw it from the viewpoint of an outside writer who doesn't find much to be sacred, and he attacked it as he did Hannibal (another show with a long history). But in that case, his vision for what the Hannibal story SHOULD be was perfect because it fit within his sensibilities. Star Trek? Not so much.

However, Kurtzman really is just a hack. I mean, the guy wrote two Transformers movies AND the Mummy reboot.

[El Guapo]

What has Kurtzman's specific role been in the Star Trek shows?

[Fireball]

He's basically become this generation's Rick Berman. He's "in charge" of Trek overall, but he doesn't directly run any of the shows.

[Fireball]

But his direction for Star Trek: Discovery was a misfire from the moment they tried to reinvent the Klingons. Thankfully, someone realized that he wasn't really the person for the job and they rapidly back peddled in season 2 on many of the things Fuller wanted.

What really gets me about the first season of Discovery is that if you make just three changes, it would have fit in basically perfectly and been received so much better, instead of having to be basically stripped down and rebuilt in flight:

• Set it in 2405 and had the set up be that a new Cold War had fallen between the Klingons and the Federation after the destruction of Romulus.

• Don't fuck up the Klingon make up.

• And if you really want Burnham to be connected to an existing Vulcan character, make her Tuvok's adopted daughter.

[Defiant]

I disagree with this. You can't really do the reunion season until the last one, otherwise why not just make TNG seasons 8, 9, and 10? While the second season of Picard was a complete disaster, the first one was pretty good, and I liked several of the new characters, particularly Elnor. I wish he'd been in season 3.

I wasn't a fan of either of the first two seasons. Season 3 had a better and more focused storyline. And while I don't think it need be TNG season 8 (It needn't have brought everyone back or done so much fan service), I do think it should have been closer to TNG, because I have to assume that the show's audience was primarily people who had watched TNG.

[hepcat]

While the second season of Picard was a complete disaster, the first one was pretty good, and I liked several of the new characters, particularly Elnor. I wish he'd been in season 3.

I said it before, but I wish they'd left Raffi behind in season 2 and we would have had Worf mentoring Elnor in season 3. I think those two together would have been great.

Caveat: I would have been okay with Raffi in season 3 had the actress convinced her husband, the great character actor Garrett Dillahunt, to appear.

[El Guapo]

But his direction for Star Trek: Discovery was a misfire from the moment they tried to reinvent the Klingons. Thankfully, someone realized that he wasn't really the person for the job and they rapidly back peddled in season 2 on many of the things Fuller wanted.

What really gets me about the first season of Discovery is that if you make just three changes, it would have fit in basically perfectly and been received so much better, instead of having to be basically stripped down and rebuilt in flight:

• Set it in 2405 and had the set up be that a new Cold War had fallen between the Klingons and the Federation after the destruction of Romulus.

• Don't fuck up the Klingon make up.

• And if you really want Burnham to be connected to an existing Vulcan character, make her Tuvok's adopted daughter.

Setting it in 2405 would also help with one of my quibbles with the show - that it was just fundamentally weird to have this hyper-advanced spore drive and Mycelial network that never was talked about or engaged with by anyone else in any of the shows set after it. Alternatively I kind of wish they had the spore drive be this mysterious hyper-advanced technology on an abandoned alien ship (possibly from future time-travelers) that they can use but which they can only loosely understand.

[hepcat]

I think the spore drive was another thing they tried to back away from as it wasn't the focus of the show that much after season 1. It became their little deux ex machina when they needed to escape/get somewhere fast. But other than that, it was on the peripheral.

[El Guapo]

I think the spore drive was another thing they tried to back away from as it wasn't the focus of the show that much after season 1. It became their little deux ex machina when they needed to escape/get somewhere fast. But other than that, it was on the peripheral.

What they probably should have done is had the drive powered by having a pilot that ate 21st century car batteries found in Los Angeles parking lots.

[hepcat]

Don't be ridiculous, dude.

...it could have been in ANY parking lot.

[Rumpy]

I think there are some writers that are fantastic...but that shouldn't be working on certain properties.

There's also the fact that I think certain writers can burn out on certain properties. Some that in the past were considered a good fit, aren't anymore due to the changing landscape of TV design. But yeah, there are definitely some that aren't a great fit on certain properties overall. I've come to feel that I don't really like Kurtzman's brand of Trek.

Personally, I think Matalas should get promoted. He's done great with this season, and I'm eager to see what else he could do with Trek.

[Fireball]

But his direction for Star Trek: Discovery was a misfire from the moment they tried to reinvent the Klingons. Thankfully, someone realized that he wasn't really the person for the job and they rapidly back peddled in season 2 on many of the things Fuller wanted.

What really gets me about the first season of Discovery is that if you make just three changes, it would have fit in basically perfectly and been received so much better, instead of having to be basically stripped down and rebuilt in flight:

• Set it in 2405 and had the set up be that a new Cold War had fallen between the Klingons and the Federation after the destruction of Romulus.

• Don't fuck up the Klingon make up.

• And if you really want Burnham to be connected to an existing Vulcan character, make her Tuvok's adopted daughter.

Setting it in 2405 would also help with one of my quibbles with the show - that it was just fundamentally weird to have this hyper-advanced spore drive and Mycelial network that never was talked about or engaged with by anyone else in any of the shows set after it. Alternatively I kind of wish they had the spore drive be this mysterious hyper-advanced technology on an abandoned alien ship (possibly from future time-travelers) that they can use but which they can only loosely understand.

In my "jotting down how I'd move Discovery to the 25th Century" document, I switched the spore drive to a transwarp drive that utilized the abandoned Borg transwarp conduit network. It still required a sentient "pilot" because Borg ships were effectively sentient due to their connection to the Collective.

[Sudy]

The spore drive/mycelial network plot was fantastic. But yeah, it's a deus ex machina that just removed any limitation on travel. Going to the edge of the galaxy, really? (As much as I want to explore out there.) And wasn't that only because of the spore drive from the 2250s? Yeah, they went bizarre distances in TOS and The Final Frontier. But Voyager also got tossed 800 years from home and it still took ages to get back even with shortcuts. I would have found it easier to accept the crazy/instantaneous travel if it had been a one-time or two-time thing that had the same result of Stammets almost dying, etc. Like with the Traveler in TNG, or Barclay's super-brain. As it was, it seemed as outlandish as what happened in Into Darkness.

I'll never accept Michael being Spock's secret sister. Not in continuity. Are we still in the main universe?

[Fireball]

I thought their relationship was very well handled, as was her relationship with Sarek.

[Sudy]

I thought it was fine in-series. I don't mind the new Spock, and especially the new Sarek. I just have trouble swallowing another new Spock/Sarek. I don't want to revisit already perfect characters. But I know I'm a nerdsnob and in the minority. My problem wasn't with Burnham's story, but rather the thought that Nimoy-Spock had a secret sister all this time, much like his secret brother in the Final Frontier lol. But at least that made sense in the context of the story. Discovery is still technically considered Prime universe, isn't it? But it's all a little fuzzy.

[Fireball]

Disco, SNW, LD, Picard, Prodigy, etc, are all 100% Prime Timeline.

[Rumpy]

I My problem wasn't with Burnham's story, but rather the thought that Nimoy-Spock had a secret sister all this time, much like his secret brother in the Final Frontier lol.

Yeah, agreed. I felt they tried a bit too hard to shoehorn that in as a connection to the original series. You already had Spock in the series as well. Would have been better if she'd maybe been one of Tuvok's ancestors.