LGBT issues thread (was Supreme Court to hear same-sex marriage cases)

[Unagi]

when they realize they have a “type” they fall for repeatedly. For me, it’s been Irish dchicks with legs and short hair.

Hey, me, too! I also prefer short hair, and it's a big plus when women have legs.

I’m a serious sucker for attractive women with great personalities and a wry sense of humor.

[GreenGoo]

Beautiful, intelligent, wealthy women are my weakness.

Call me old fashioned.

[LawBeefaroni]

I am an educated liberal who used to actually be pretty smart, though biology was never really my thing, and I still don't really understand the concept that gender is a social construct. I guess it is the difference between sex and gender? I mean I totally understand that gender ROLES are a social construct.

I'd guess that you understand better than you think. The ROLES are a social construct, and that's pretty much the whole of it. Gender no longer really refers to physical qualities at all. Gender (modern usage) is pretty much entirely the roles and qualities that we (society) assign to people. It is our understanding of what a 'male' or 'female' is, our expectations of them, and which category we (traditionally) have assigned to them. Look at 'act like a man' and 'be more ladylike' - that's 100% gender. The modern usage deals with which* of those gender roles you naturally fit into. It's your instincts, your qualities, your mannerisms, your daily norms, your drives, your feelings, your preferences, etc.

Is it really just a matter of agreeing on definitions of words? I think our EMR has 8 or more fields related to sex/gender/pronouns/preferred name/and others I can't remember. There used to be only one. Sex (or gender or whatever term) at birth is crucially important in medicine since disease is more concerned with biology, obviously. But clinicians also need to be aware of all the other sex/gender/sexuality/etc factors.

Point being we need agreed upon definitions for sex, gender, sexual preference, etc or else it's just tower of babble.

[Blackhawk]

Is it really just a matter of agreeing on definitions of words?

Only in the context of surveys and people sometimes misunderstanding questions in a way that makes them appear more conflicted than they are. We changed the terminology, and that change hasn't disseminated through all of society just yet.

[GreenGoo]

Only in the context of surveys and people sometimes misunderstanding questions in a way that makes them appear more conflicted than they are. We changed the terminology, and that change hasn't disseminated through all of society just yet.

I agree with this, but I also think the change is not recent. I suspect this happened long ago but only the people affected by the definitions and scientific understanding of gender were involved.

i.e. this is not new or a 2020's thing. If I had to guess (and I do, since I'm not looking into it), I'd say the medical terminology and understanding began in the 50's at least, if not much earlier. Society obviously viewed them as different back then, and if I may use outdated and outrageous lingo, "freaks".

But they aren't "freaks", they are as god made them (or biology did) and therefore don't deserve the ridicule and abuse they are receiving. This abuse has parallels in the civil liberties movement, suffrage movement, gay rights movement etc.

People who were pushed to the bottom of society are now pushing back, and society doesn't like that, for a lot of different reasons. It's a shame we can't break this pattern of treating others (extra) horribly when they ask you to treat them with respect.

[Blackhawk]

i.e. this is not new or a 2020's thing. If I had to guess (and I do, since I'm not looking into it), I'd say the medical terminology and understanding began in the 50's at least, if not much earlier.

I did look into it last night when I was writing that post. The distinction between sex and gender dates from 1955, but it didn't start to be used that way by the public until the feminist movement of the 70s.

[GreenGoo]

Neat!

[Victoria Raverna]

Politicians have tried to make climate change illegal.

If that can work, isn't that a good thing? We don't want climate change, right?

[Blackhawk]

Hoosiers, in the largest number on record, elected me Attorney General because they knew they were getting a passionate fighter who — like them — is beating back the culture of death, grievance and transanity being pushed by radicals in workplaces, schools, media and government.

Ladies and gentlemen, the Attorney General of Indiana.

Anyone who isn't straight can certainly rely on getting justice from our state legal system.

[Alefroth]

What is the culture of death?

[Blackhawk]

I believe it was a reference to abortion, but it was so packed with propaganda that it was hard to make sense of if you don't already speak fluent bullshit. But hearing the term 'transanity' from an AG is just so far out there that I had to stop and see if it was real.

It was all tied to him bragging about going after the doctor and hospital who performed the abortion on the 10-year-old rape victim after RvW was killed and Ohio's trigger laws were... triggered.

[Holman]

My older son (19) is in a relationship with a non-binary partner. My younger son (17) is in a relationship with a trans boy. No matter what we Olds think, the coming generations understand that gender is fluid and hardly ever totally fixed.

I think they're right.

In every culture that has ever existed, there have been people who cross the established lines of gender identity. Sometimes they have been severely punished, sometimes they have been accepted, sometimes they have had to play by specific rules inside specific boundaries, but they have never been absent. The fact that some of them have sought their own identity even under pain of death and punishment tells us that "traditional gender roles" are never always enough for everyone.

Is it any wonder that a world where those roles are loosening up is seeing an uptick in non-traditional gender identity?

[Alefroth]

I believe it was a reference to abortion, but it was so packed with propaganda that it was hard to make sense of if you don't already speak fluent bullshit.

Ah yeah, that makes sense.

[GreenGoo]

Anti-trans march in Ottawa

[malchior]

I know we're way past the threshold here but sometimes you can still get a bit of a shock about the absurdity. Todays? I saw a hard right discussion today about the missing F-35.

Apparently that has turned into a huge conspiracy theory on the right. You can see articles in the Washington Examiner dissecting the oddity of the missing F-35. How does this tie into LGBT issues? Great question you might ask. Like the blue line dog flag sometimes you can't make the connections that these smooth brains do.

They are apparently obsessed with the fact that the pilot bailed out and the flying for some distance. I mean...physics. But whatever. Of course, it has been taken to the extreme and the "truth" is that the plane must have been fine and it was all pilot error. And why did this pilot make an error pray tell? Because the woke Airforce has lowered flight qualifications to allow transgendered people and diversity hires to fly. Mhm...kay.

[GreenGoo]

The parallels to the insane claims against the jews on the run up to wwii can't be denied.

Terrifying.

[Blackhawk]

They are apparently obsessed with the fact that the pilot bailed out and the flying for some distance. I mean...physics.

[malchior]

Super.

[Daehawk]

Maybe the aliens will fly by and come down and remove our collective heads from our asses. Doubtful at this point though.

[Smoove_B]

Dad suing over trans policy in school:

The father of three Cherry Hill high school students has filed a federal lawsuit against the school district and the N.J. Department of Education over its guidance on notifying parents when their children request accommodations related to being transgender.

In the suit, filed Oct. 12 in U.S. District Court, the father, Frederick K. Short Jr., says the policy violates his Fourteenth Amendment right to raise his children and make decisions about their mental health care.

...

The suit took issue with the DOE’s guidance, which does not require that school staff notify parents of their child’s gender identification. It said such policies “provide for secrecy and the facilitation of double-lives [and] are psychologically unhealthy for youth.”

The guidance also notes that schools should keep separate files with different names for trans students and notify parents only when required by law or in some cases involving bullying.

Guessing this will be a hot-button political issue in state and local elections for the near future. Can't wait to see what kind of trash get floated by the GOP at a national level.

[hepcat]

Now this row over transgender people participating in a sport has me confused. Female pool player Lynne Pinches refuses to play transgender opponent and walks off at start of match. I mean, it's pool, for christ's sake. I can sympathize with some of the claims of inequality being introduced by transgender participants when it comes to more physical sports like swimming, but this is friggin' pool. Being able to lift more than your opponent really isn't a factor.

edit: ah, i see where the complaint lies:

Players calling for tougher restrictions claim trans women often have greater upper body strength enabling them to make a more powerful initial break.

Still, that doesn't seem like that big of a deal to me.

[malchior]

What about that initial break! Totally a game changer!

Edit: The edit beat me to this crucial point!

[hepcat]

I'm not a pool player. My history of table based sports revolves around air hockey in my fraternity house back in college, although that was never about winning but more about trying to get the puck off the table and into someone's nuts when playing them...

...so wait...is that it? They're afraid of getting hit in the groin during the break? Couldn't they just move to the opposite end of the table? Or do transgender pool players move into groin striking position at all times?

[Smoove_B]

Everything is fine:

A city in Tennessee is using a recently passed ordinance essentially prohibiting homosexuality in public to try to ban library books that might violate the new rules.

Murfreesboro passed an ordinance in June banning “indecent behavior,” including “indecent exposure, public indecency, lewd behavior, nudity or sexual conduct.” As journalist Erin Reed first reported, this ordinance specifically mentions Section 21-72 of the city code. The city code states that sexual conduct includes homosexuality.

Anyone who violates the new ordinance is barred from hosting public events or selling goods and services at public events for two years. Anyone who violates the ordinance “in the presence of minors” is barred for five years.

...

Murfreesboro’s new ordinance is part of a much larger wave of attacks on LGBTQ rights in Tennessee and the rest of the country. In the past year, the so-called Volunteer State became the first state to try to ban drag performances. That law was overturned in court.

In March, the Tennessee House of Representatives passed a bill that would allow people to refuse to perform a marriage if they disagree with it, essentially gutting marriage equality. The bill was introduced in the Senate but deferred until next year.

[hepcat]

I was reminded of good in the world yesterday at work. My boss’ kid stopped by. They were born a girl and the decided that wasn’t what they wanted while in college. Now they go by a male name and prefer they/them. While this would result in anger and mistreatment by your average right wing douchebag, my boss loves his child and had no issues introducing them to everyone again (we hadn’t seen them since they were very young). Then proudly showing off his kid’s video work (they graduated with a degree in media and now work on music tours as a videographer for some very famous people) to everyone. At no point did I see anything but a proud dad. It was reaffirming, to say the least, when you realize how many awful fucking people out there are throwing their children out of their homes when they’re still teenagers over something as stupid as being afraid of their child being a part of the LGBQT community.

[YellowKing]

Yeah it's sad, because how parents react to that situation is completely a choice. Down one path you lose a child, they lose a parent, and you create lifelong resentment. Down the other path, you get happy stories like the above.

[Jaymann]

Everything is fine:

A city in Tennessee is using a recently passed ordinance essentially prohibiting homosexuality in public to try to ban library books that might violate the new rules.

Murfreesboro passed an ordinance in June banning “indecent behavior,” including “indecent exposure, public indecency, lewd behavior, nudity or sexual conduct.” As journalist Erin Reed first reported, this ordinance specifically mentions Section 21-72 of the city code. The city code states that sexual conduct includes homosexuality.

Anyone who violates the new ordinance is barred from hosting public events or selling goods and services at public events for two years. Anyone who violates the ordinance “in the presence of minors” is barred for five years.

...

Murfreesboro’s new ordinance is part of a much larger wave of attacks on LGBTQ rights in Tennessee and the rest of the country. In the past year, the so-called Volunteer State became the first state to try to ban drag performances. That law was overturned in court.

In March, the Tennessee House of Representatives passed a bill that would allow people to refuse to perform a marriage if they disagree with it, essentially gutting marriage equality. The bill was introduced in the Senate but deferred until next year.

What if they disagree with the marriage because it is their ex?

[Isgrimnur]

High Court, in declining to weigh conversion therapy ban, allows law to stand

The U.S. Supreme Court Monday declined to hear a case challenging Washington state's ban on conversion therapy of minors. In doing so, the court left standing a lower court decision that upheld the state's ban on a therapy that the American Medical Association says "is not based on medical and scientific evidence."

The Washington passed law, enacted in 2018, allows the state to revoke the licenses of therapists who try to change a minor's sexual orientation. Brian Tingley, a family counselor and advocate for conversion therapy, challenged the law in court, represented by the anti-LGBTQ Alliance Defending Freedom. He claimed that the law violates his First Amendment right to free speech.

Two lower courts upheld the law.

The court's decision not to hear the case Monday included no reasons, as is standard when it denies a case. But, Justices Samuel Alito, Brett Kavanaugh, and Clarence Thomas dissented from the order, and would have heard the case.

[coopasonic]

the anti-LGBTQ Alliance Defending Freedom

ummm...

I guess freedom from stuff that they see as icky? Or tempting?

[Daehawk]

Just want to say Im sad and embarrassed by my fellow so called humans and citizens with the way they blatantly hate and censure my fellow Earth riders. Id say Im sorry but its all on them and I can only hope we all vote them out or for change. Until then may karma bite their collective asses.

[Isgrimnur]

the anti-LGBTQ Alliance Defending Freedom

ummm...

I guess freedom from stuff that they see as icky? Or tempting?

Alliance Defending Freedom is the world’s largest legal organization committed to protecting religious freedom, free speech, marriage and family, parental rights, and the sanctity of life. We defend your most cherished liberties in Congress, state legislatures, and courtrooms across the country—all the way to the U.S. Supreme Court if necessary.

[Blackhawk]

In other words, freedom for people like them to be rid of people not like them.

[Pyperkub]

Pope Francis dragging the Catholic Church into the 21st century

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/18/worl ... ssing.html

[hepcat]

Sadly, way too many of them are kicking and screaming as they go.

[Alefroth]

Pope Francis dragging the Catholic Church into the 21st century

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/18/worl ... ssing.html

On a case by case basis and they still recognize marriage between a man and a woman. I wonder if they define what a man and a woman are, and if they require proof.

And it's merely a blessing, not intended to give the impression of marriage.

[Smoove_B]

Dear Ken Paxton, go f yourself:

The Seattle Children’s Hospital filed a lawsuit in Travis County District Court on Dec. 7 against the Texas Office of the Attorney General (OAG), after that agency requested documents related to gender transition policies and any such care provided to Texas children.

However, hospital claims that the OAG lacks jurisdiction to demand such records from the hospital, and that Washington’s “Shield Law” protects it from requests made by states that “restrict or criminalize reproductive and gender-affirming care.”

[Alefroth]

I can't tell from the article. What is SHC seeking, just that Paxton stop?

[Smoove_B]

I think so? I guess they're suing to get an official ruling that he's out of line, possibly also to recover all legal costs associated with defending themselves against his absurd legal challenge.

[Alefroth]

I'd love to see Paxton's nose bloodied even a little.

[gbasden]

I'd love to see Paxton's nose bloodied even a little.

I'd love to see his nose bloodied in an entirely non-metaphorical sense.