An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
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- Dave Allen
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An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
Both Democrats and Republicans are often accused of putting their party's interests above the needs of the American people. Now would be an excellent time for Democrats to indicate their desire to re-establish a functioning legislative branch by creating a small list of Republicans they could vote for in a bloc large enough to end this crazy contest for house speaker.
Of course this would mean stifling the joy they are experiencing over the current Republican chaos. But by doing this they would let us all know that they are truly sick of bipartisan politics by extending this olive branch and show they really care about our democracy.
Of course this would mean stifling the joy they are experiencing over the current Republican chaos. But by doing this they would let us all know that they are truly sick of bipartisan politics by extending this olive branch and show they really care about our democracy.
Jesus said, "Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body."[Matt 10:28] God can totally destroy us.
Jesus also said, "For my Father's will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”[John 6:40] Eternal life is conditional.
His disciple John wrote, "Whoever has the Son has eternal life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have eternal life. [1 John 5:12] Eternal life is optional.
Jesus also said, "For my Father's will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”[John 6:40] Eternal life is conditional.
His disciple John wrote, "Whoever has the Son has eternal life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have eternal life. [1 John 5:12] Eternal life is optional.
- Smoove_B
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
If I'm understanding you correctly, it's the responsibility of the party that has 212 (of 217 needed votes) to try and find a compromise with the GOP?
Maybe next year, maybe no go
- hepcat
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
The moment democrats offer up a name for someone they'd vote, that person would become a punching bag in the republican party. Your plan fails to take into the account just how much republicans hate...well...everyone.
He won. Period.
- Dave Allen
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
Jesus said, "Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body."[Matt 10:28] God can totally destroy us.
Jesus also said, "For my Father's will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”[John 6:40] Eternal life is conditional.
His disciple John wrote, "Whoever has the Son has eternal life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have eternal life. [1 John 5:12] Eternal life is optional.
Jesus also said, "For my Father's will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”[John 6:40] Eternal life is conditional.
His disciple John wrote, "Whoever has the Son has eternal life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have eternal life. [1 John 5:12] Eternal life is optional.
- Alefroth
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
Dave Allen wrote: ↑Fri Oct 20, 2023 6:40 pm Both Democrats and Republicans are often accused of putting their party's interests above the needs of the American people. Now would be an excellent time for Democrats to indicate their desire to re-establish a functioning legislative branch by creating a small list of Republicans they could vote for in a bloc large enough to end this crazy contest for house speaker.
Of course this would mean stifling the joy they are experiencing over the current Republican chaos. But by doing this they would let us all know that they are truly sick of bipartisan politics by extending this olive branch and show they really care about our democracy.
Why can't Republicans show they are the 'bigger' party?
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
Sadly, there are probably a lot of people that think like Dave.
- Smoove_B
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
Yes, I'm seeing on social media that this is the fault of the Democrats because they won't support the nomination of whatever GOP member that just finished detailing how they'll dismantle everything while refusing to work with the Democrats after being seated. Why won't the Democrats be reasonable?
Maybe next year, maybe no go
- hepcat
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
Also, dem leadership HAS indicated they'd support someone who wasn't an insurrectionist or an extremist. So they have tossed out an olive branch, in that regard. What they don't want is MAGA to be in control. That way leads only to pain and misery for both sides, as we're seeing right now. The MAGA people cannot and will not work with anyone. Even their own. They are the least fit people for politics I have ever had the displeasure of seeing in power.
He won. Period.
- Smoove_B
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
Yes - "We'd support a reasonable nominee."
"The House GOP would like to submit the Honorable Mr. Jordan as House Speaker."
I mean, really.
"The House GOP would like to submit the Honorable Mr. Jordan as House Speaker."
I mean, really.
Maybe next year, maybe no go
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
Now would be a fantastic time for just 6 Republicans to pick a Democrat speaker.Dave Allen wrote: ↑Fri Oct 20, 2023 6:40 pm Now would be an excellent time for Democrats to indicate their desire to re-establish a functioning legislative branch by creating a small list of Republicans they could vote for in a bloc large enough to end this crazy contest for house speaker.
Just 6 reasonable Republicans can do the right thing, any 6 of them.
What you ask is for an entire Democratic house to fall in line behind some member of the GOP.
Surely 6 people is a smaller ask than 212 people ???
Or is it just that there is no way to imagine 6 Republicans could do what you want 212 Democrats to do.
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
Hepcat got it right before. That very obvious problem is why the premise here is not particularly well thought out but then again this is a troll thread.
- LordMortis
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
I actually don't think it's a bad deal. However, it seems to me that all got shot to hell when they reach across the aisle group imploded when democrats let McCarthy sink. So now they have to be the even bigger party after bipartisan efforts were shut down on them. Still. Put forth a list of people who consider the current Supreme Court a travesty and do not consider TFG the leader of their party and I think I'd have a staring point.
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
When the Democrats saved McCarthy's clean funding bill do you know what he did next? He went on Sunday talk shows and blamed Democrats for the spending debacle. Not even a "well, you know, we couldn't have done it without my colleagues across the aisle." Not even that. I'd have thrown my shoe at him were I in the room.LordMortis wrote: ↑Fri Oct 20, 2023 9:34 pm I actually don't think it's a bad deal. However, it seems to me that all got shot to hell when they reach across the aisle group imploded when democrats let McCarthy sink. So now they have to be the even bigger party after bipartisan efforts were shut down on them. Still. Put forth a list of people who consider the current Supreme Court a travesty and do not consider TFG the leader of their party and I think I'd have a staring point.
- hepcat
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
Yeah, McCarthy is a POS.
He won. Period.
- YellowKing
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
Fool me once, shame on, shame on you, fool me....you can't get fooled again.
- LordMortis
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
Ohhhhhhhh there is no love lost for letting McCarthy sink. He was the scum on the shit on the gum on the bottom of a shoe.
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
Why is it always the Democrats that has to be the bigger party, to their own self interest to the side to help the Republicans out of their self-induced jam?
Maybe just *once* the GOP could put the country first and not nominate an insurrectionist shit bag for Speaker?
Just once can it be on the GOP to do the right thing?
Maybe just *once* the GOP could put the country first and not nominate an insurrectionist shit bag for Speaker?
Just once can it be on the GOP to do the right thing?
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Christians, Moslems, Hindus, Jews
And every other race, creed, colour, tint or hue
Get down on their knees and pray
The raccoon and the groundhog neatly
Make up bags of change
But the monkey in the corner
Well he's slowly drifting out of range
- waitingtoconnect
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
I don’t think there is much the republicans can do. Any compromise to the democrats makes them “rinos”Dave Allen wrote: ↑Fri Oct 20, 2023 6:40 pm Both Democrats and Republicans are often accused of putting their party's interests above the needs of the American people. Now would be an excellent time for Democrats to indicate their desire to re-establish a functioning legislative branch by creating a small list of Republicans they could vote for in a bloc large enough to end this crazy contest for house speaker.
Of course this would mean stifling the joy they are experiencing over the current Republican chaos. But by doing this they would let us all know that they are truly sick of bipartisan politics by extending this olive branch and show they really care about our democracy.
And it wasn’t democrats that moved on McCarthy.
I can’t see democrats siding with someone like Jim Jordan when he can’t command loyalty within his own party. And he is not a centrist.
Arguably the centrist factions in both parties could get together like they used to to run things if the extremes in both play up. But the republicans killed that in the 1990s
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
Agree with all of this except the “this is a troll thread” part. Really? Not to get all meta, but how is this a troll thread? The post is probably something on the minds of many, many Americans right now. The notion is misguided, but is it really troll behavior? That response feels off to me, but maybe there’s a history here I’m not aware of.
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- Pyperkub
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
It's a troll post. He's not seriously responding to anything.
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the
wow didn't expect that...
I was honestly just bringing some brinkmanship here after reading a recent article by Sahil Kapur and Julia Jester.
Excerpt:
Jeffries said Democrats want “a bipartisan path” to reopening the House but didn’t outline what that would look like. Democrats unanimously nominated Jeffries to be speaker, but there’s no chance of him winning when Republicans have a 221-212 majority. Still, Democrats say the onus is on the GOP to negotiate with them and make concessions if they want help electing a speaker.
There are no serious discussions taking place on a coalition speaker picked with bipartisan votes, according to senior lawmakers and aides in both parties.
“No Republican has come to leadership to have a serious conversation of substance,” said a senior Democratic aide. “This is on Republicans to come to the Democrats to try to find a compromise.”
Jesus said, "Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body."[Matt 10:28] God can totally destroy us.
Jesus also said, "For my Father's will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”[John 6:40] Eternal life is conditional.
His disciple John wrote, "Whoever has the Son has eternal life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have eternal life. [1 John 5:12] Eternal life is optional.
Jesus also said, "For my Father's will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”[John 6:40] Eternal life is conditional.
His disciple John wrote, "Whoever has the Son has eternal life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have eternal life. [1 John 5:12] Eternal life is optional.
- Victoria Raverna
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
They have to wait for the Republicans to approach them since if Democrats are the one that pick the acceptable Republican candidates for house speakers, those Republicans are going to be labelled as RINO and likely to not able to get GOP votes.
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
Both Democrats and Republicans are often accused of putting their party's interests above the needs of the American people. Now would be an excellent time for Republicans to indicate their desire to re-establish a functioning legislative branch by recognizing that Jeffries has more support than any other candidate that has been fielded and vote for him to end this crazy contest for house speaker.
I mean, if the job is such a horror show, why not give it to a Democrat?
I mean, if the job is such a horror show, why not give it to a Democrat?
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- hepcat
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
Let’s hope that Matt Gaetz’s name becomes synonymous with dysfunction in government after this though. The crazy eight need to be purged from Washington with extreme prejudice.
He won. Period.
- Smoove_B
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the
I'd humbly suggest you lead with that next time - so it doesn't just sound like you're floating a hot take.Dave Allen wrote: ↑Sat Oct 21, 2023 3:34 am I was honestly just bringing some brinkmanship here after reading a recent article by Sahil Kapur and Julia Jester.
Maybe next year, maybe no go
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
I don't think he cares much - all indications are he's going to run for FL governor and they seem to eat this shit up down there. Probably the result of spending too much time in the sun.
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the
I get it. My 'nuff said wasn't 'nuff said.Smoove_B wrote: ↑Sat Oct 21, 2023 10:21 amI'd humbly suggest you lead with that next time - so it doesn't just sound like you're floating a hot take.Dave Allen wrote: ↑Sat Oct 21, 2023 3:34 am I was honestly just bringing some brinkmanship here after reading a recent article by Sahil Kapur and Julia Jester.
"Oh Lord, please don't let me be misunderstood" by The Animals.
Jesus said, "Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body."[Matt 10:28] God can totally destroy us.
Jesus also said, "For my Father's will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”[John 6:40] Eternal life is conditional.
His disciple John wrote, "Whoever has the Son has eternal life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have eternal life. [1 John 5:12] Eternal life is optional.
Jesus also said, "For my Father's will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”[John 6:40] Eternal life is conditional.
His disciple John wrote, "Whoever has the Son has eternal life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have eternal life. [1 John 5:12] Eternal life is optional.
- Grifman
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
Exactly, he was nothing but a douche bag when he could have been magnanimous and appreciative.raydude wrote: ↑Fri Oct 20, 2023 9:50 pmWhen the Democrats saved McCarthy's clean funding bill do you know what he did next? He went on Sunday talk shows and blamed Democrats for the spending debacle. Not even a "well, you know, we couldn't have done it without my colleagues across the aisle." Not even that. I'd have thrown my shoe at him were I in the room.LordMortis wrote: ↑Fri Oct 20, 2023 9:34 pm I actually don't think it's a bad deal. However, it seems to me that all got shot to hell when they reach across the aisle group imploded when democrats let McCarthy sink. So now they have to be the even bigger party after bipartisan efforts were shut down on them. Still. Put forth a list of people who consider the current Supreme Court a travesty and do not consider TFG the leader of their party and I think I'd have a staring point.
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the
Dave Allen wrote: ↑Sat Oct 21, 2023 3:34 amwow didn't expect that...
I was honestly just bringing some brinkmanship here after reading a recent article by Sahil Kapur and Julia Jester.
Excerpt:Jeffries said Democrats want “a bipartisan path” to reopening the House but didn’t outline what that would look like. Democrats unanimously nominated Jeffries to be speaker, but there’s no chance of him winning when Republicans have a 221-212 majority. Still, Democrats say the onus is on the GOP to negotiate with them and make concessions if they want help electing a speaker.
There are no serious discussions taking place on a coalition speaker picked with bipartisan votes, according to senior lawmakers and aides in both parties.
“No Republican has come to leadership to have a serious conversation of substance,” said a senior Democratic aide. “This is on Republicans to come to the Democrats to try to find a compromise.”
Don’t you mean bipartisanship rather than brinksmanship?
Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions. – G.K. Chesterton
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the
The thing is that the Democrats have been the "bigger" party, and we've had this discussion all year in the house follies thread.Dave Allen wrote:wow didn't expect that...
I was honestly just bringing some brinkmanship here after reading a recent article by Sahil Kapur and Julia Jester.
Excerpt:Jeffries said Democrats want “a bipartisan path” to reopening the House but didn’t outline what that would look like. Democrats unanimously nominated Jeffries to be speaker, but there’s no chance of him winning when Republicans have a 221-212 majority. Still, Democrats say the onus is on the GOP to negotiate with them and make concessions if they want help electing a speaker.
There are no serious discussions taking place on a coalition speaker picked with bipartisan votes, according to senior lawmakers and aides in both parties.
“No Republican has come to leadership to have a serious conversation of substance,” said a senior Democratic aide. “This is on Republicans to come to the Democrats to try to find a compromise.”
Here is my congress person on what he's was thinking when it the democrats could have saved Mccarthy
Find us an elected Republican who has integrity and would keep his or her word and would work with all members of congress, while not kowtowing to those members who asked for pardons in the wake of Jan 6th, and maybe there's a path to what you asked.
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
It was a data based assessment.Kurth wrote: ↑Fri Oct 20, 2023 11:06 pmAgree with all of this except the “this is a troll thread” part. Really? Not to get all meta, but how is this a troll thread? The post is probably something on the minds of many, many Americans right now. The notion is misguided, but is it really troll behavior? That response feels off to me, but maybe there’s a history here I’m not aware of.
1. This idea might be in the minds of many, many Americans; however this specific idea mostly comes from and lives almost entirely in the right-wing information bubble in any sort of durable form. In comparison, I've seen relatively few discussions of this idea from liberals and centrists; they always acknowledge the reality that the Republicans have to make an offer first though because they are the broken party here.
Edit: With examples from Xitter protected by spoiler tags for those who hate the terrible but still useful Xitter!
Spoiler:
2. Irregular or new posters in this forum are very likely to have troll intentions. There is a high chance it's trolling when the idea source appears to come from the right wing information space.
3. The image post was confusing to say the least. That could just be miscommunication but the later explanation doesn't make much sense either.
Now we have new information though that refines my viewpoint:
The offered explanation that this came from reading the quoted NBC News political analysis is...odd. It was an analysis piece about the Democratic motives based on the political math and was published a week ago. It also was being framed in it's intersection with 2024 strategy and offered a relatively deep analysis that explained Democratic party rationale in line with what many of us know. How that translates into a thought that maybe it should be the source of a discussion about whether the Democrats should act like the "bigger" party is...strange to me.
Being a relatively old source, in the intervening time we have seen fairly reasonable Democratic party offers floated out and shot down. Not integrating that known knowledge into the "theory" here suggests that this could be more an uninformed or low information take and/or filtered through a diet of right-wing slop. I don't know for sure but I'm reassessing it to a 'probable troll post' as a minute refinement.
Last edited by malchior on Sat Oct 21, 2023 1:39 pm, edited 4 times in total.
- Smoove_B
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
As seen online - "The Republicans won't even vote for themselves - why should I?"
Maybe next year, maybe no go
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the
It's almost as if people are the problem.
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the
Yes, I meant bipartisan, but the brinkmanship will be in how long Democrats wait to do what I initially suggested. Sure I have a pretty simplistic outlook; uninformed, half-baked, and late to the table. I therefore humbly represent the majority of Americans.Grifman wrote: ↑Sat Oct 21, 2023 11:14 amDave Allen wrote: ↑Sat Oct 21, 2023 3:34 amwow didn't expect that...
I was honestly just bringing some brinkmanship here after reading a recent article by Sahil Kapur and Julia Jester.
Excerpt:Jeffries said Democrats want “a bipartisan path” to reopening the House but didn’t outline what that would look like. Democrats unanimously nominated Jeffries to be speaker, but there’s no chance of him winning when Republicans have a 221-212 majority. Still, Democrats say the onus is on the GOP to negotiate with them and make concessions if they want help electing a speaker.
There are no serious discussions taking place on a coalition speaker picked with bipartisan votes, according to senior lawmakers and aides in both parties.
“No Republican has come to leadership to have a serious conversation of substance,” said a senior Democratic aide. “This is on Republicans to come to the Democrats to try to find a compromise.”
Don’t you mean bipartisanship rather than brinksmanship?
Last edited by Dave Allen on Sat Oct 21, 2023 6:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Jesus said, "Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body."[Matt 10:28] God can totally destroy us.
Jesus also said, "For my Father's will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”[John 6:40] Eternal life is conditional.
His disciple John wrote, "Whoever has the Son has eternal life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have eternal life. [1 John 5:12] Eternal life is optional.
Jesus also said, "For my Father's will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”[John 6:40] Eternal life is conditional.
His disciple John wrote, "Whoever has the Son has eternal life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have eternal life. [1 John 5:12] Eternal life is optional.
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
Ignore everything offered as an explanation as to why it isn't a reasonable position, doubling down on a right-wing idea, embracing ignorance, and thinking that makes themselves part of a "majority". Looks like my initial read was on target.
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
Example of Democrats showing leadership.
- Smoove_B
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
The GOP has really backed themselves into a corner. Either capitulate to the ~10 lunatics that want to shut down the government in order to seat a chaos-goblin Speaker or cooperate with the Democrats to come to a agreement on a Speaker both parties can work with.
I wonder what they'll choose?
I wonder what they'll choose?
Maybe next year, maybe no go
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the
You still have it backwards, the brinksmanship is all about which republican will decide that courting democrats can get them the Speakership.Dave Allen wrote:Yes, I meant bipartisan, but the brinkmanship will be in how long Democrats wait to do what I initially suggested. Sure I have a pretty simplistic outlook; uninformed, half-baked, and late to the table. I therefore humbly represent the majority of Americans.Grifman wrote: ↑Sat Oct 21, 2023 11:14 amDave Allen wrote: ↑Sat Oct 21, 2023 3:34 amwow didn't expect that...
I was honestly just bringing some brinkmanship here after reading a recent article by Sahil Kapur and Julia Jester.
Excerpt:Jeffries said Democrats want “a bipartisan path” to reopening the House but didn’t outline what that would look like. Democrats unanimously nominated Jeffries to be speaker, but there’s no chance of him winning when Republicans have a 221-212 majority. Still, Democrats say the onus is on the GOP to negotiate with them and make concessions if they want help electing a speaker.
There are no serious discussions taking place on a coalition speaker picked with bipartisan votes, according to senior lawmakers and aides in both parties.
“No Republican has come to leadership to have a serious conversation of substance,” said a senior Democratic aide. “This is on Republicans to come to the Democrats to try to find a compromise.”
Don’t you mean bipartisanship rather than brinksmanship?
If you haven't noticed, the GOP is having GOP-only secret ballots for Speaker.
Exactly what influence do you think democrats have in those?
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Black Lives definitely Matter Lorini!
Also: There are three ways to not tell the truth: lies, damned lies, and statistics.
Also: There are three ways to not tell the truth: lies, damned lies, and statistics.
- Alefroth
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Re: An opportunity for Democrats to prove they are the "bigger" party
Have any of the recent candidates campaigned for Democratic votes at all?