STARSHIP R.SCOTT (WW Game) - Game Over.

[Scoop20906]

Mod Note: Technically, everyone is asleep in their cryo pod during course corrections (night) so in the spirit of the game, no one should be able to talk. However, I'm not going to be a stickler about this rule so just take it easy on the posts during the course corrections (night) periods. I promise to have a relatively short deadline for course corrections (night) periods and a long period for days.

[Scoop20906]

MOD NOTE: We are waiting for 2 players to check their ROLE PMs. Once they have read them, I will announce the hard deadline for Course Correction (NIGHT) One.

[Scoop20906]

MOD NOTE: I will be on vacation going to PAX (http://www.paxsite.com/) again this year so I will be unable to moderate the game from Wednesday, Sept. 2 to Monday, Sept. 7. I will see if I can get someone to "guest moderate" for me during that period of time. I will keep you guys posted.

[Chaosraven]

...

[Scoop20906]

STARSHIP R.SCOTT - DAY ONE

As the cryo pods open, those in stasis wake up and start to talk ...

..... damn, I didn't even fall asleep ...

... yeah right! ...

... Its true, im a very light cryo sleeper ...

... knock it off, we've got serious business ...

... Ok, yeah, something new is on the terminal over here ...

Code: Select all

655 WARMING UP ROUTINE STARTED

SCRIPT BREAK -- CRYO POD #11 LOCKED DOWN PER DIVERGENT CORP. AGENT ORDER 11

655 WARMING UP ROUTINE FINISHED

"Hold up! Cryo Pod #11 is locked down? Who's that?" asked Remus West.

"It looks like that guy named Chaosraven. And whats this crap about Divergent Corp?" asked Lagom Lit.

"Damn, one of us has to be from the company. If I figure out who it is ...." growled tru1cy.

"Ok, another message has come up on the terminal." announced theohall.

Code: Select all

***** CICP COMMUNICATIONS ****** >> CREW, INITIATE REPAIR FUNCTION #15 - RESPOND WHEN COMPLETED.
***** CICP COMMUNICATIONS ****** >> CREW, ALIEN ORGANISM IS PRESENT. ELIMINATE OR CONTAIN USING DIVERGENT CROP CONTAINMENT PROCEDURE #1

"Alien?!? Great. What are we going to do about this?" asked theohall.

"Only one thing we can do. We need to start eliminating the alien. Its one of us. Best way as far as I am concerned is shooting the most suspicious one of us out the airlock." Sean remarked.

"Well, lets hold a vote. Majority winner gets to taste space." grimaced Grundbegriff.

=========================================
STARSHIP R.SCOTT - DAY ONE

Players:
theohall
Sean, Minister of KtSP
Mr Bubbles
Isgrimnur
Remus West
Grundbegriff
Newcastle
Lagom Lite
Chaosraven
pr0ner
tru1cy
Austin

Votes:
None

Majority is 7 votes.

A majority vote will close voting. If the Day ends without a majority reached no player will be thrown out the airlock.
The HARD Deadline for Day One is 9:00 pm ET on Tuesday, September 22, 2009.

[Isgrimnur]

...

I guess his nap is going to be longer than he expected...

[Remus West]

Well, is there any reason the Engineer should not release Chaosraven? The only player that needs anyone locked down (as far as I can tell) is the Symbiont. The Engineer gets to use his power once per day so why leave anyone in lockdown?

[Newcastle]

I'd say have the engineers release, no reason why not.

[Lagom Lite]

The only reason to keep him suspended is if we thought he was the alien (or a rival faction ). I'd rather have him incriminate himself than in suspended animation.

[Remus West]

The only reason to keep him suspended is if we thought he was the alien (or a rival faction ). I'd rather have him incriminate himself than in suspended animation.

If we thought him the alien would we not need him released to chuck out the airlock? Or are we able to rid ourselves of those locked up as well as awake?

[Isgrimnur]

The only reason to keep him suspended is if we thought he was the alien (or a rival faction ). I'd rather have him incriminate himself than in suspended animation.

If we thought him the alien would we not need him released to chuck out the airlock? Or are we able to rid ourselves of those locked up as well as awake?

You are correct that we'd need to unlock him.

Players who are locked down in a cryo pod may NOT be voted for.

[Remus West]

The only reason to keep him suspended is if we thought he was the alien (or a rival faction ). I'd rather have him incriminate himself than in suspended animation.

If we thought him the alien would we not need him released to chuck out the airlock? Or are we able to rid ourselves of those locked up as well as awake?

You are correct that we'd need to unlock him.

Players who are locked down in a cryo pod may NOT be voted for.

He could still be shot then. So we can get rid of locked down players twice but only at the expense of the shots.

[Austin]

Maybe the guards should just come out. If they lose their shot upon being converted then it might actually help us.

[Lagom Lite]

The only reason to keep him suspended is if we thought he was the alien (or a rival faction ). I'd rather have him incriminate himself than in suspended animation.

If we thought him the alien would we not need him released to chuck out the airlock? Or are we able to rid ourselves of those locked up as well as awake?

You are correct that we'd need to unlock him.

Players who are locked down in a cryo pod may NOT be voted for.

He could still be shot then. So we can get rid of locked down players twice but only at the expense of the shots.

Hmm... You're right, I thought about the fact that he can't vote if he's suspended so that would be a reason to keep him under ice, but at this point there's only one alien, right? Not enough to tip the scales anyway.

[Isgrimnur]

Hmm... You're right, I thought about the fact that he can't vote if he's suspended so that would be a reason to keep him under ice, but at this point there's only one alien, right? Not enough to tip the scales anyway.

Night Sequence of Resolution:
Symbiont order is processed.
Alien's order is processed.
Computer Hacker's medical report is decrypted.

The odds of Chaosraven being an alien is 1/12, since the conversion would happen after the lockdown. ... or would it matter, since everyone's in stasis when the Alien converts...?

Also, given that 11 of us are up and around, wouldn't that make the current majority to be six people?

SCOOP!!

[Scoop20906]

Also, given that 11 of us are up and around, wouldn't that make the current majority to be six people?

SCOOP!!

Ummm, yep. Thats correct. My mistake.

===============================
STARSHIP R.SCOTT - DAY ONE

Locked Down Players:
Chaosraven

Players:
theohall
Sean, Minister of KtSP
Mr Bubbles
Isgrimnur
Remus West
Grundbegriff
Newcastle
Lagom Lite
pr0ner
tru1cy
Austin

Votes:
None

Majority is 6 votes.

A majority vote will close voting. If the Day ends without a majority reached no player will be thrown out the airlock.
The HARD Deadline for Day One is 9:00 pm ET on Tuesday, September 22, 2009.

[Lagom Lite]

Night Sequence of Resolution:
Symbiont order is processed.
Alien's order is processed.
Computer Hacker's medical report is decrypted.

(...)

Beginning of Day Play Boilerplate:
Computer Hacker's medical report is announced in the main thread (Computer Hacker is not revealed).
Guard, will you use your pocket incinerator gun today?
Engineer, will you disengage a cryo pod's lockdown?

(...)

Rule Changes:

Computer Hacker MUST make a scan each course correction.

So, we've had one night, meaning we have two aliens now? Aren't we supposed to get a medical report too then? If not, are we to assume that the Hacker is now a converted alien, alternatively Chaosraven on ice?

[Remus West]

Night Sequence of Resolution:
Symbiont order is processed.
Alien's order is processed.
Computer Hacker's medical report is decrypted.

(...)

Beginning of Day Play Boilerplate:
Computer Hacker's medical report is announced in the main thread (Computer Hacker is not revealed).
Guard, will you use your pocket incinerator gun today?
Engineer, will you disengage a cryo pod's lockdown?

(...)

Rule Changes:

Computer Hacker MUST make a scan each course correction.

So, we've had one night, meaning we have two aliens now? Aren't we supposed to get a medical report too then? If not, are we to assume that the Hacker is now a converted alien, alternatively Chaosraven on ice?

The way that quote reads, the Hacker acts "at night" so even if he were Chaosraven we would get the read out.

[Lagom Lite]

Night Sequence of Resolution:
Symbiont order is processed.
Alien's order is processed.
Computer Hacker's medical report is decrypted.

(...)

Beginning of Day Play Boilerplate:
Computer Hacker's medical report is announced in the main thread (Computer Hacker is not revealed).
Guard, will you use your pocket incinerator gun today?
Engineer, will you disengage a cryo pod's lockdown?

(...)

Rule Changes:

Computer Hacker MUST make a scan each course correction.

So, we've had one night, meaning we have two aliens now? Aren't we supposed to get a medical report too then? If not, are we to assume that the Hacker is now a converted alien, alternatively Chaosraven on ice?

The way that quote reads, the Hacker acts "at night" so even if he were Chaosraven we would get the read out.

Depends if the "Night Sequence of Resolution" means that any action taken is cancelled out by earlier resolutions. Or to put in in another way, if we get no medical report today, Chaosraven could not possibly be an alien, since this is the first night and there is only one alien - the original one. If CR were an alien, he would get frozen before he got a chance to convert anyone. That means he couldn't have converted the Hacker, in which case we'd get a medical report.

Or am I reading the rules wrong?

[Grundbegriff]

Course Correction Boilerplate:
Computer Hacker: Which player's cryo pod medical report will you decrypt?

Scoop: Shouldn't we be receiving a Medical Report based on last night's hack?

[pr0ner]

Course Correction Boilerplate:
Computer Hacker: Which player's cryo pod medical report will you decrypt?

Scoop: Shouldn't we be receiving a Medical Report based on last night's hack?

From how I read the rules, this is correct.

[Scoop20906]

Course Correction Boilerplate:
Computer Hacker: Which player's cryo pod medical report will you decrypt?

Scoop: Shouldn't we be receiving a Medical Report based on last night's hack?

Re: Computer Hacker - The hacker's scan takes place at night and us mandatory.

Also, all rulez were correctly observed and carried out last course correction (night) and at the beginning of the day. That is all the mod will say.

[Remus West]

Course Correction Boilerplate:
Computer Hacker: Which player's cryo pod medical report will you decrypt?

Scoop: Shouldn't we be receiving a Medical Report based on last night's hack?

Re: Computer Hacker - The hacker's scan takes place at night and us mandatory.

Also, all rulez were correctly observed and carried out last course correction (night) and at the beginning of the day. That is all the mod will say.

So, either the hacker was converted and thus lost his ability or he is Chaosraven and can not use his ability due to lockdown. Either way sucks ass.

[Grundbegriff]

Also, all rulez were correctly observed and carried out last course correction (night) and at the beginning of the day. That is all the mod will say.

Thanks for clarifying.

Scoop: Can the Alien convert someone who is locked down in a cryopod? Or can he convert only those in unlocked pods?

[Scoop20906]

Also, all rulez were correctly observed and carried out last course correction (night) and at the beginning of the day. That is all the mod will say.

Thanks for clarifying.

Scoop: Can the Alien convert someone who is locked down in a cryopod? Or can he convert only those in unlocked pods?

Ahh, thanks Grund. I can see its not in the rulez. Here is further clarification on locked down cryo pods:

Cryo Pod Lockdown:
Players who's cryo pod was locked down may not post or vote in the main game thread and are considered in stasis. However, the player's cryo pod may be disengaged by the engineer so please pay attention to the game. Players who are locked down in a cryo pod may NOT be voted for. The alien organism may NOT attempt to convert a player that has been locked down in his cryo pod. The guards MAY use their one shot incinerator guns to kill a player who is locked down in their cryo pod.

[Lagom Lite]

So, either the hacker was converted and thus lost his ability or he is Chaosraven and can not use his ability due to lockdown. Either way sucks ass.

It does, but it also means we know for a fact CR is human today. So that's kind of like a scan.

[Grundbegriff]

The Rules

Days and Course Corrections:
During course corrections, players must enter to their cryo pods to service the ship's accelerations and de-accelerations. The Symbiont and Alien players are immune to Course corrections and may leave their cryo pods according their specific role rulez.

Scoop:
You say that the Symbiont and the Alien are both immune to course corrections.
You say this means that each "may leave" the cryopod.
You also say that the Symbiont has a super-lockdown capability that can contain an Alien in its cryopod despite this immunity. (The only way to capture one!)

Q1: Does this also mean that the Symbiont can use his super-lockdown capability on himself to lock himself down despite his immunity? Or can he never be locked down at all?

Q2: If the Symbiont superlocks the Alien, does that prevent the Alien from converting someone? (expected answer: "yes")

[Grundbegriff]

So, either the hacker was converted and thus lost his ability or he is Chaosraven and can not use his ability due to lockdown. Either way sucks ass.

It does, but it also means we know for a fact CR is human today. So that's kind of like a scan.

Right. Unless the original Alien can convert others while he's under super-lockdown, Chaosraven must be human (cannot be a converted alien) and exactly one of these two sentences is true (and the other false):

(A) Chaosraven is the Hacker and some other person was converted into an alien.
xor
(B) Chaosraven is not the Hacker and the Hacker was converted into an alien.

As soon as we have both an unlocked Chaosraven and a successful Medical Report Hack on the same night, we'll know for sure that (A) was what happened.

But suppose we also receive no Medical Report tomorrow. If Chaosraven is locked down again, then we'll still be unable to decide between (a) and (b). If Chaosraven is free and no Medical Report comes, we also will be unable to decide between them, since on that night, Chaosraven might be a Hacker preempted by conversion.

This means that getting a Medical Report -- any Medical Report -- is the most clarifying thing that could happen. Therefore, we must try to make it happen, if it can happen.

The optimum way for the Alien to sow confusion would be to convert Chaosraven tomorrow if the 'raven isn't locked down. That would prevent a Hacker Raven from generating a Medical Report. That would leave us in the dark.

Therefore:
1. The Symbiont must not lock down Chaosraven tonight
AND
2. If we still receive no Medical Report tomorrow, we must airlock Chaosraven.

The lack of a Medical Report will mean that one of these combinations is the case:

(a) Chaosraven is not the Hacker after all, the Hacker was converted on the first night, and the Alien might've converted Chaosraven to sow confusion.
(b) Chaosraven is the Symbiont (if self-lockdown is possible), and he has an incentive to keep at least one alien alive.
(c) Chaosraven is the original Alien (if conversion activity while under super-lockdown is possible) and he converted the Hacker.

I'm not sure (pending Scoop's clarifications) whether (b) and (c) are even possible. What is already clear is that any of (a), (b), (c) will be sufficient grounds for airlocking if we get no Medical Report tomorrow.

[Lagom Lite]

The lack of a Medical Report will mean that one of these combinations is the case:

(a) Chaosraven is not the Hacker after all, the Hacker was converted on the first night, and the Alien might've converted Chaosraven to sow confusion.
(b) Chaosraven is the Symbiont (if self-lockdown is possible), and he has an incentive to keep at least one alien alive.
(c) Chaosraven is the original Alien (if conversion activity while under super-lockdown is possible) and he converted the Hacker.

Or (d) Chaosraven was the Hacker, and recently got turned into an alien. Which supports your case.

Would there be any harm in waking him up, and simply ask him? We know he's not alien nor symbiont (pending rules clarifications), so what reason could he have to lie? If he's the Hacker, he's already in the "majority" (the criminals). If he's not, he simply has to state he's not, he doesn't have to reveal his faction or role.

If Chaosraven states he is indeed the Hacker:
* Tomorrow, if he's alive and there is no medical report, we airlock him as an alien.
* As long as there is a medical report every morning, we know we can trust him.
* He will likely get converted by the alien, but he's already a prime target.

If Chaosraven states he is not the Hacker:
* We then know the real Hacker got converted into an alien on night 1.
* If a medical report shows up, Chaosraven lied about his role and will likely get converted the next night.

If Chaosraven doesn't say anything about his role:
* We airlock him tomorrow for being a likely converted alien, assuming Grund is correct that he would be a likely target.

At any rate, Chaosraven is toast.

[Scoop20906]

Scoop:
You say that the Symbiont and the Alien are both immune to course corrections.
You say this means that each "may leave" the cryopod.
You also say that the Symbiont has a super-lockdown capability that can contain an Alien in its cryopod despite this immunity. (The only way to capture one!)

Q1: Does this also mean that the Symbiont can use his super-lockdown capability on himself to lock himself down despite his immunity? Or can he never be locked down at all?

Correct.

Q2: If the Symbiont superlocks the Alien, does that prevent the Alien from converting someone? (expected answer: "yes")

Correct.

Alien Organism
- Alien Organism (convert humans during course correction)
- Converted Human/Alien (learns name of Alien Organism when converted, can not convert)

Night Sequence of Resolution:
Symbiont order is processed.
Alien's order is processed.
Computer Hacker's medical report is decrypted.

[Austin]

I am a guard. If you vote for me today, you are on a short list for being shot. If I cannot shoot after tomorrow I am a converted alien, lynch me.

[Grundbegriff]

The lack of a Medical Report will mean that one of these combinations is the case:

(a) Chaosraven is not the Hacker after all, the Hacker was converted on the first night, and the Alien might've converted Chaosraven to sow confusion.
(b) Chaosraven is the Symbiont (if self-lockdown is possible), and he has an incentive to keep at least one alien alive.
(c) Chaosraven is the original Alien (if conversion activity while under super-lockdown is possible) and he converted the Hacker.

Or (d) Chaosraven was the Hacker, and recently got turned into an alien. Which supports your case.

Yep. I wrote:

If Chaosraven is free and no Medical Report comes, we also will be unable to decide between them, since on that night, Chaosraven might be a Hacker preempted by conversion.

I don't know how I left it off the combination list. Oops.

In any case, it still points to airlocking him if we get no Medical Report -- a point on which we agree.

Would there be any harm in waking him up, and simply ask him?

Only the harm done if he lies. And yet he cannot lie.

If he claims to be the Hacker and we receive Reports, we have a reason believe this and reason to trust him.
If he claims to be the Hacker and we lack Medical Reports, his lie is exposed and we jettison him.
If he claims not to be the Hacker and we receive Reports, his lie is exposed and we jettison him.
If he claims not to be the Hacker and we lack Medical Reports, we have reason to believe this and reason to jettison him.

Therefore, there's no harm in waking him up. It would be a good use of the Engineering discipline.

If Chaosraven states he is indeed the Hacker:
* Tomorrow, if he's alive and there is no medical report, we airlock him as an alien.
* As long as there is a medical report every morning, we know we can trust him.
* He will likely get converted by the alien, but he's already a prime target.

All good.

If Chaosraven states he is not the Hacker:
* We then know the real Hacker got converted into an alien on night 1.
* If a medical report shows up, Chaosraven lied about his role and will likely get converted the next night.

I like your logic. (Why haven't you joined in before? Don't use the "no time" excuse, like The Meal. All of us lack sufficient time. )

[Grundbegriff]

Scoop:
You say that the Symbiont and the Alien are both immune to course corrections.
You say this means that each "may leave" the cryopod.
You also say that the Symbiont has a super-lockdown capability that can contain an Alien in its cryopod despite this immunity. (The only way to capture one!)

Q1: Does this also mean that the Symbiont can use his super-lockdown capability on himself to lock himself down despite his immunity? Or can he never be locked down at all?

Correct.

Scoop! (vocalized as "Khaaannn!" while shaking fist....)

I'm giving you mutually exclusive options there:

"Either he can use the super-lockdown capability on himself" XOR "he can never be locked down at all."

Only one of those can be true, so "Correct" is not an adequate answer!

I'm trying to determine whether Chaosraven could possibly be a self-suppressing Symbiont.

[Grundbegriff]

I am a guard. If you vote for me today, you are on a short list for being shot. If I cannot shoot after tomorrow I am a converted alien, lynch me.

Why wait till tomorrow to test you? Why is it important that you survive today? And why would you step forward and raise this issue now, on the first day? Wouldn't it make more sense to keep that secret, since we know that there are up to two Aliens on board?

[Austin]

I am a guard. If you vote for me today, you are on a short list for being shot. If I cannot shoot after tomorrow I am a converted alien, lynch me.

Why wait till tomorrow to test you? Why is it important that you survive today? And why would you step forward and raise this issue now, on the first day? Wouldn't it make more sense to keep that secret, since we know that there are up to two Aliens on board?

Go ahead and test me. I will not be put over before one of the voters gets shot. Whether or not this makes sense, time will tell.

[Lagom Lite]

I like your logic. (Why haven't you joined in before? Don't use the "no time" excuse, like The Meal. All of us lack sufficient time. )

I'm shy.

[Grundbegriff]

Lagom shy, for here you are!

[Lagom Lite]

I am a guard. If you vote for me today, you are on a short list for being shot. If I cannot shoot after tomorrow I am a converted alien, lynch me.

Why wait till tomorrow to test you? Why is it important that you survive today? And why would you step forward and raise this issue now, on the first day? Wouldn't it make more sense to keep that secret, since we know that there are up to two Aliens on board?

Go ahead and test me. I will not be put over before one of the voters gets shot. Whether or not this makes sense, time will tell.

Hmm... But tomorrow you could become an alien. You could be an alien right now for all we know. And if you're a marine, that's like painting a bullseye on yourself for the aliens.

This might resolve it: IF Chaosraven is the Hacker, he could scan Austin tonight to check his claim. If Austin is human, he's likely telling us the truth, we'll know we can trust him tomorrow and he can postpone his shot until then if he doesn't want to use it now.

[Remus West]

The only thing Austin's claim means is that tomorrow he shoots someone or gets the airlock. Day after that he likely gets the airlock since he becomes a prime conversion target once the shot is used. It forces us into the would he or wouldn't he convert the obvious discussion.

[Austin]

Hmm... But tomorrow you could become an alien.

Yes, and you should lynch me if I am unable to shoot.

This might resolve it: IF Chaosraven is the Hacker, he could scan Austin tonight to check his claim. If Austin is human, he's likely telling us the truth, we'll know we can trust him tomorrow and he can postpone his shot until then if he doesn't want to use it now.

Scoop, does the scan come before or after the conversion?