[Miniatures] Painting tips and progress reports (with pics!)

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Fri Mar 29, 2013 6:27 pm

All I do is adjust the contrast/white levels to fix what the camera messes up. What you see is very close to what is sitting on my desk.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Wed Apr 03, 2013 8:37 pm

While I cannot hold a candle to Blackhawk's work, I'm at least proud to say that my entire S1 Zombicide set is now painted. Even with my amateur attempts, I think the survivors came out decently. Up close they're a little sloppy, but for moving around a table? Perfect -- and way better than just plain molded plastic.

I just looked through all the S2 figures...and it's going to be a busy Fall. I'm going to continue to help my buddy with his Descent 2nd edition monsters and maybe get a bunch of his hero characters started so he can finish up the detailing and shading. I also just picked up my first set of MERCS figures (KemVar) and now I get to read up on how to assemble and paint metal miniatures.

Boudreaux · Post by **Boudreaux** » Wed Apr 03, 2013 11:48 pm

Those look pretty nice to me. Great job!

coopasonic · Post by **coopasonic** » Thu Apr 04, 2013 8:57 am

Yeah, I would be happy to have you paint my minis so you can have some more practice. Shall I send them over?

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Thu Apr 04, 2013 9:05 am

Prior to doing this, I've never picked up a paintbrush. It really wasn't that bad - particularly with the zombies knowing I had 8 tries to work on the same model. Plus, they're zombies -- if things turn south, splash some blood over the wonky part and call it a day. I really want to emphasize just how relaxing it is to just sit with some music on and paint - and I did it all with a 5/0 brush and a sharpened toothpick. Once I painted the first one and saw that it wasn't that difficult to make them table-top ready, I was able to just get over my fears of ruining everything and hammer them out.

coopasonic wrote:Yeah, I would be happy to have you paint my minis so you can have some more practice. Shall I send them over?

As an amateur, I think you'll find my rates quite reasonable.

Zarathud · Post by **Zarathud** » Thu Apr 04, 2013 9:09 am

Nicely done. I have been too tired this week to paint after work and seing this helps my motivation to continue. The idea of getting 210+ more minis to paint is pretty cool and scary.

coopasonic · Post by **coopasonic** » Thu Apr 04, 2013 9:11 am

I think I would be more willing if I could figure out a way to store them after they are painted. I tossed the plastic trays the zombies came in for space and have them all in plastic baggies by type. I don't think that would serve very well once they are painted. Anyone have ideas for how to carry them after painting (economically - yes I have spent $300+ on zombicide but I want a cheap storage solution dammit)?

hepcat · Post by **hepcat** » Thu Apr 04, 2013 9:50 am

I'm looking at getting some of these for my Malifaux figures.

...actually, just 1 as they store up to 66 figures each.

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Thu Apr 04, 2013 10:36 am

Smoove_B wrote:While I cannot hold a candle to Blackhawk's work, I'm at least proud to say that my entire S1 Zombicide set is now painted.

It isn't as wide a gap as it seems. Keep in mind that in the time you painted 71 miniatures, I painted four. I actually need to speed things up and get some of my boardgame miniatures painted - at my usual rate, it would take years.

coopasonic · Post by **coopasonic** » Thu Apr 04, 2013 10:37 am

hepcat wrote:I'm looking at getting some of these for my Malifaux figures.

...actually, just 1 as they store up to 66 figures each.

Thanks, the price is certainly right. I'll have to consider it.

Zarathud · Post by **Zarathud** » Thu Apr 04, 2013 11:25 am

The zombicide battlefoam inserts are $40 and fits 110 minis and cards. The top lid sits 3/4 inch too high after the boards go on top.

But that's not cheap and won't work with Season 2 because the Toxic City Mall box isn't going to be big enough.

hepcat's econobox solution would be 5 boxes. I've also been looking at KR Multicases.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Sun Apr 07, 2013 10:02 am

Spent a few hours yesterday working with my first metal miniature. In short, I'm glad I started working on plastic figures because painting metal was a totally different experience. I think this was about three hours worth of work for a single figure but I'm happy with how he looks. KemVar Sniper for MERCS:

Above and beyond the detail work, even after washing and priming the figure I had a heck of a time getting the paint on in even coats. The legs in particular are like 5+ passes, which isn't something I needed to do for the plastic figures. I picked the easiest one first (i.e. didn't require assembly) so now I get to figure out the rest.

I do have some Army Painter ink wash coming in the mail. Tried to find it locally but struck out. I'm hoping when applied I can get some of the details to pop, but I guess we'll see.

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Sun Apr 07, 2013 10:24 am

You seem to have a very steady hand and a good eye for color. Those are some of the hardest skills to develop. The rest is just learning a few techiques.

Five coats over priming? What kind of paint are you using? A regular acrylic thinned 1-1 or even 2-1 shouldn't require five coats.

TiLT · Post by **TiLT** » Sun Apr 07, 2013 10:27 am

That's a very solid basecoat, so you've got a great foundation for your wash. For that kind of mini I'd also recommend that you try highlighting. That's the step that makes the biggest difference, though you shouldn't attempt it without shading first. Highlighting will take far less time than basecoating.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Sun Apr 07, 2013 10:45 am

I was afraid of over-priming, so I set up a cardbox box and stuck the figure to a wooden dowel so I could spin it around. I think I gave the figure 2 very thin primer coats as I was afraid of ruining the details. Maybe that was my problem? It's just a Krylon all purpose metal primer (not the fusion designed for plastics) - nothing special. The paint is craft store acrylics ($0.59 a bottle), coming straight from the source (no dilution).

I do want to try the highlighting (as I've read here and elsewhere), though like everything else, I'm nervous as hell.

Blackhawk wrote:You seem to have a very steady hand and a good eye for color.

This was a harder model for me to paint as it required using a cartoon sketch as my inspiration. The other examples I found online I didn't really care for and some of the models I saw were using blues and hot pinks. I try to get it to look as close to the box art as I can or the examples provided by the publisher. I do think a lot of my time was spent guessing and second guessing color choices, so I'm glad it looks good to someone else.

coopasonic · Post by **coopasonic** » Sun Apr 07, 2013 11:09 am

The paint job looks great. It's a hideously bad stance for a sniper, but the paint looks good.

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Sun Apr 07, 2013 11:25 am

She's bracing for the anti-kick.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Sun Apr 07, 2013 12:16 pm

I also have a new appreciation for basing. I guess I did it the dirty/fast way by simply gluing the mini base sprue into the provided slot and then sprinkling rock and flock onto white PVA glue. The idea of posting and then gluing a figure directly to a completely covered base is pretty impressive, though I'm not quite sure I'm there yet. Some of the other MERCS figures are in action-y poses though (one is leaping) so I'm guessing I have to figure something out. There are some really awesome guides online showing what people are capable of. I'm always amazed at the creative application of things you find around the house. To that end (and because I need some barricades), I am going to try and make a series of busted-up walls using some hard board and painted Styrofoam bricks. I guess since they too are miniature in nature, I will post my progress here.

For reference, my wife completely thinks I've gone off the deep end. I told her that wasn't possible as I didn't have a 6'x6' war gaming table in the basement -- yet.

hepcat · Post by **hepcat** » Sun Apr 07, 2013 4:22 pm

Seppe turned me onto cork board. That stuff can be used to make almost anything when it comes to basing.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Thu Apr 18, 2013 2:06 pm

Been breaking my stones trying to paint more of the MERCS figures. Between general assembly and then dealing with a much higher level of detail than the Zombicide figures...I'm definitely leaning towards sticking with plastic minis in the future.

Anyway, after "ruining" the sniper with the Army Painter Ink, I broke down today and ordered a can of the Army Painter Soft Tone Quickshade. I figure it will work on both my Zombicide survivors and hopefully my MERCS. As you can see, they are in desperate need of what I hope the Quickshade will provide.

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Thu Apr 18, 2013 2:40 pm

Out of curiosity, what did the ink do?

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Thu Apr 18, 2013 2:46 pm

I'll try to get some better shots, but it didn't highlight anything or make it the sniper look like what happened when I washed the zombicide figures with wood stain. The ink seemed to just instantly penetrate the acrylic paint and completely change the color of whatever I put it on. If you look at the helmet of the sniper it was originally the same shade as the helmet of the other two soldiers. All of the knee and thigh pads turned to a graphite-grey color. I was hoping it would run into all the deep lines (on the uniform and pads) to add some detailing, but it just seemed to dull out and darken all the colors.

I'm sure I used it wrong (either based on the paint selection or I picked the wrong tone) but I'm hopeful over the Quickshade. I have a feeling the Ink might work really well on the zombie figures and when the next batch comes in (or if my buddy lets me experiment on his Descent 2 minis), I'm going to try it on something with a darker palette.

Here:

Pre-Ink

Inked (and then the suede repainted multiple times)

There is a Matte finish that I applied to the Sniper post-inking

Boudreaux · Post by **Boudreaux** » Thu Apr 18, 2013 3:00 pm

Those look great!

It's funny - I can look at minis painted like this, with just a well-done base coat and minimal or no shading or highlighting, and then look at minis that are done to really professional, display-quality standards where it's obvious hours and hours of work went into them. They both look equally pleasing to me.

I haven't gotten good enough at shading/highlighting to be confident in my painting. To me, it always looks like I tried to shade/highlight it. There's no "cohesiveness" to the final look, if you know what I mean. That's the part I can't figure out.

I tried painting my Spartacus miniatures using some of the Reaper paints from my Kickstarter order. It included several skin tones like Fair Skin, Tanned Skin, and a Flesh Wash. I started with a basecoat I mixed myself, then used the Flesh Wash which came out really dark and reddish. On top of that I went back and painted the Tanned Skin, and that looked pretty good. Then I tried to highlight using the Fair Skin, but the mini went from "sun-bronzed gladiator" to "sun-bronzed gladiator with some sort of pigmentary skin disease". I don't know if I need to thin the paints more, or paint a smaller area for highlights, or what. Just can't get it to look right.

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Thu Apr 18, 2013 3:01 pm

My first suggestion would generally be to thin the ink a bit, as it is working more like a wash than a shading ink (different companies' inks are formulated differently - some will wash, some will fall into the crevices.) If I had the ink here, I'd mix two drops of it with a drop of matte medium and a drop of flow improver (thins it down so it'll go into the deep areas, and makes it more transparent so it won't shade too much.) I doubt you have those there, though.

The only real difference between a shade and a wash is the dilution. A wash does tint the underlying color, and is often formulated for precisely that purpose, as you can use it to blend colors together. If you used five shades of red on a cloak, for instance, a red wash would smooth out the transitions.

FWIW, most of the time inking is not a quick-shade. It is an intermediate step meant to add depth and bring out detail, but you generally follow up by highlighting up manually afterwards. For instance, you might thin down some of the original helmet color and apply that to the raised areas of the helmet, then add a tiny bit of white to the base color and repeat the process. Ink by itself (with some exceptions) isn't a final step.

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Thu Apr 18, 2013 3:19 pm

Boudreaux wrote: I tried painting my Spartacus miniatures using some of the Reaper paints from my Kickstarter order. It included several skin tones like Fair Skin, Tanned Skin, and a Flesh Wash. I started with a basecoat I mixed myself, then used the Flesh Wash which came out really dark and reddish. On top of that I went back and painted the Tanned Skin, and that looked pretty good. Then I tried to highlight using the Fair Skin, but the mini went from "sun-bronzed gladiator" to "sun-bronzed gladiator with some sort of pigmentary skin disease". I don't know if I need to thin the paints more, or paint a smaller area for highlights, or what. Just can't get it to look right.

It sounds like they're assuming you're doing this:

Tanned
Wash
Tanned
Tanned + Fair
Fair

If so, and it is coming out blotchy, I'd guess that you need to thin them more. I do base coats at 1-1 water (well, flow improver) to paint, and if I'm really highlighting multiple coats, then I go as thin as 4-1. With the list there, I'd say 1-1 for base coats and 2-1 for highlights and see how it goes. You might also try distilled water, as some water chemicals can interact with paint. Sometimes the highlights are almost invisible going on - you have to build them up, as the idea is that they're almost transparent so that they blend in with the colors underneath.

As to areas, the base coat should be everything. The wash should be everything. The re-application after the base coat should be everything that isn't a deep shadow - probably 80-90% of the surface. The first highlight should probably be a quarter of the surface, and the final highlight should be minimal and very thin.

Most is Tanned Flesh. There are some dark spots (the wash). The light spots across the chest, tops of the shoulders, top of the head - that's the Tanned plus Fair. The final Fair Skin highlight would only be on the very highest areas - elbows, nose, edges of the muscles. It isn't the area that is bright and shiny - it is only the very center of that area. The areas that, were the figure chrome, would sparkle.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Thu Apr 18, 2013 3:25 pm

I appreciate all the feedback.

I did try watering down the ink last night (with distilled water) and messing around on the squad leader (guy with the sword). There are little circular patches on the shoulders that I then brushed the ink/water mix into and BAM! it filled int the recesses and made it look right, but didn't completely change the suede color to point where it was unrecognizable. I'm guessing I should go back and dry brush that spot and the darkened areas will remain? Regardless, when I tried the same thing on the sleeves and leg pads, it just ran off - even when I held it in a way to discourage such behavior. The picture I'm using as my guide, it looks like the artist actually painted the suede pads grey first, and then carefully painted the suede color over the top, leaving the lines that dark grey. I sort of did that on the shin, but it's a larger area. I just don't have those chops (or eyes) to try and attempt that on such a small scale (if that's indeed what they did - you can see the picture here). Maybe they have a hair-width brush or something -- even my favorite tool (the sharpened toothpick) can't get that kind of fidelity.

I do chalk all this up to learning, but based on my skill level, I think I'm more of a "slap a solid base coat on and then dip/brush some type of substance all over the figure and hope for the best" type of painter. I just don't think I have the skill / talent / eye for highlighting and shadowing, despite watching various videos and reading up on the subject. I'd hoped the ink was my solution, but I'm guessing it will be this Quickshade. I'm really happy with how my second round of Zombies came out when I spent a good 60+ minutes laboriously painting the wood stain on each figure instead of just slopping it on quick and letting gravity do the work.

TiLT · Post by **TiLT** » Thu Apr 18, 2013 3:27 pm

Those miniatures look great, Smoove!

Smoove_B wrote:I'll try to get some better shots, but it didn't highlight anything or make it the sniper look like what happened when I washed the zombicide figures with wood stain.

You might have misunderstood what shading is supposed to do. Adding a wash will never highlight anything. Almost all washes will add some color to the mini, and their main purpose is to add shade. You will either have to use a brighter basecoat when you want to shade but not highlight, or highlight after shading to bring back the original color.

You should also (as the final step) apply a matt varnish. The glare from the ink will hide some of the detail, and the varnish will bring it back.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Thu Apr 18, 2013 4:15 pm

Oh yeah, I think I'm still in uncharted waters, without question. I painted a bunch of zombie proxies for my buddy to help him out with our Descent 2ed campaign. He picked all the colors; I just did all the actual work and subsequent "dip" with wood stain:

That's about 10 minutes after the wood stain was brushed on, but you can see where it pooled into the cracks and did what I guess is "shading". I thought the specially formulated ink would do something similar for my MERCS figures, but all it did was change the color of the applied paint. I guess ideally I should have washes for each of the color groups I own?

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Thu Apr 18, 2013 5:22 pm

Smoove_B wrote:I appreciate all the feedback.

I did try watering down the ink last night (with distilled water) and messing around on the squad leader (guy with the sword). There are little circular patches on the shoulders that I then brushed the ink/water mix into and BAM! it filled int the recesses and made it look right, but didn't completely change the suede color to point where it was unrecognizable. I'm guessing I should go back and dry brush that spot and the darkened areas will remain? Regardless, when I tried the same thing on the sleeves and leg pads, it just ran off - even when I held it in a way to discourage such behavior. The picture I'm using as my guide, it looks like the artist actually painted the suede pads grey first, and then carefully painted the suede color over the top, leaving the lines that dark grey. I sort of did that on the shin, but it's a larger area. I just don't have those chops (or eyes) to try and attempt that on such a small scale (if that's indeed what they did - you can see the picture here). Maybe they have a hair-width brush or something -- even my favorite tool (the sharpened toothpick) can't get that kind of fidelity.

I assume you're talking about the knee/thigh/etc pads. I can't know exactly what the artist did, but if I were going for that same effect, I'd:

1 - Start by painting the pads, or the edges of the pads dark gray.
2 - Cover the remainder with a medium gray.
3 - Highlight with medium gray + white, covering a little less of the pad than previously, and working toward the higher (brighter) areas.
4 - Repeat #3, several times, each time increasing the ratio of white to gray until I had a near-white.
5 - Do a final highlight with almost-pure white, but only on the very rims of the pads where the light would catch them. It would be very diluted (3-1, maybe) and applied brushing from the near-edge toward the edge.
6 - Mix up a thin wash of pale brown and apply several layers to the knee and shin pads to represent dirt rubbed into them from kneeling.

Alternately:
1 - Paint the pads medium gray
2 - Ink wash the pads with a black or black-plus-brown ink
3 - Proceed with #3 as above.

A lot of it is practice, and a lot of it is just learning the techniques. You don't paint those cracks. You start with the cracks already dark and paint around them.

Now, I will say one thing: The two absolute hardest colors to paint are black and white. They are an absolute pain, as (counter-intuitively) there is very little black paint on black parts and very little white on white parts.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Thu Apr 18, 2013 6:04 pm

That's what I sort of figured (lots and lots of layers). I'm just sort of getting my brain around the idea of painting in layers now; I feel like I'm still "brute force" painting colors on without regard to how it will impact the end product. I'd probably need to either have someone teach me or watch very, very detailed videos. I'm a copycat by nature, though I don't know if I ultimately have the patience. Regardless, it's still mostly enjoyable and at the end of the day I still have table-ready figures. Feels weird to be taking up such a new skill as I get ready to enter the second half of my life, but I guess I could be doing worse things for a midlife crisis, right?

Zarathud · Post by **Zarathud** » Thu Apr 18, 2013 6:45 pm

I use 2 layers of too thick basecoats in bright colors then washing to make it darker. Washing a figure always scares me--and I've never dipped or quickwashed. I'm almost done with my 6 zombicide fatties except for details (blood/tools), wash and highlights.

Boudreaux · Post by **Boudreaux** » Fri Apr 19, 2013 12:15 pm

So here's a question - aren't the Bones minis supposed to be paintable right out of the box? I prepped one of my new Bones minis to paint last night - straightened a couple of parts and gave it a soapy wash/rinse - and when I went to put a basecoat down the paint just beaded up on the plastic like it was waxed. Even unthinned paint straight out of the bottle didn't want to stick to it.

Is this something a "flow improver" would help with? Even after priming it with Army Painter stuff, lightly thinned Reaper paint really didn't want to stick to it. It was much better than before, but it still felt like I really had to use a lot of paint to get any coverage.

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Fri Apr 19, 2013 12:29 pm

From my own experience, and from what I've read, most acrylic paints work fine on unprimed Bones, but thinned paints, including naturally thin paints, do not. They bead.

TiLT · Post by **TiLT** » Fri Apr 19, 2013 12:58 pm

I used the Reaper paints straight out of the bottle on the primed Bones minis I painted, and had no trouble with it. I even used some of it thinned, though I prefer unthinned for the base coat.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Sun Apr 21, 2013 9:05 pm

I am truly beginning to loathe metal minis, in particular the heads. In this case, I was given three heads for two bodies. I can appreciate that some people like the customizations, but after fiddling with them, it's simply not possible to attach them with glue as I was able to do with guns and arms. Is the appropriate answer Milliput or Kneaditite?

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Sun Apr 21, 2013 9:49 pm

Well, the best answer is pinning. If that isn't possible, then an epoxy or one of the compounds you mentioned is an option.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Sun Apr 21, 2013 10:00 pm

Even if I were to lose my mind and attempt to pin it, there are huge gaps on the neck where it should join the body. Or am I supposed to pin it and then fill in said gaps with [Product]?

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Sun Apr 21, 2013 10:30 pm

Well, I can tell you what I'd do. I'd drill it and cut the pin, glue the pin in one side (superglue), the add milliput where the neck should be. I'd then add superglue to the other side and push them together, squeezing the milliput between the head and torso so that it worked as both adhesive and filler, after which (and before it dried), I'd remove and smooth the excess milliput.

Again, though, I tend to give things the full treatment, which isn't necessarily the easiest or only way to get them done.

Debris · Post by **Debris** » Mon Apr 22, 2013 4:04 pm

I like to pin first with appropriate super glue and then add filler into the gap after everything has dried. It's a little less messy and a heck of a lot easier to fix if you eff it up.

A good pinning tip/technique for lining up drill holes: drill the pin hole for one of the items you are putting together. On the other put a very small ball of Blue Tac. Dry fit the two pieces together, but don't squeeze down too much. Just enough to get the Blue Tac slightly squished. Pull apart carefully and you should have a small tab of where the Blue Tac went into the hole. That is where you drill the other piece. I think it's easier, less messy and more reliable than the usual "paint on the end of the pin" technique.

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Mon Apr 22, 2013 4:13 pm

Debris wrote: A good pinning tip/technique for lining up drill holes: drill the pin hole for one of the items you are putting together. On the other put a very small ball of Blue Tac. Dry fit the two pieces together, but don't squeeze down too much. Just enough to get the Blue Tac slightly squished. Pull apart carefully and you should have a small tab of where the Blue Tac went into the hole. That is where you drill the other piece. I think it's easier, less messy and more reliable than the usual "paint on the end of the pin" technique.

I like that idea. I use the paint technique myself, but will give this a try.