The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

For discussion of religion and politics

Moderators: LawBeefaroni, $iljanus

Post Reply
User avatar
Captain Caveman
Posts: 11687
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 8:57 am

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by Captain Caveman »

Octavious wrote:Don't have time to read through it myself, but does it say that he told Trump he's not under investigation? That would tick me off it's true he told him that. I see that's what Fox News is implying.
Yes, he told him that the investigation of collusion wasn't focused on him personally. Trump repeatedly pressures him to make this information public, but Comey declines, and notes in his statement that doing so would require him to issue a corrective if at some point Trump does become a focus.

So Trump pretty clearly obstructed justice, just not in a case against him personally. I'm not sure how that does him any favors.
User avatar
Smoove_B
Posts: 55014
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 12:58 am
Location: Kaer Morhen

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by Smoove_B »

$iljanus wrote:In my head I can hear Donald "Thumbs" Trump saying all that in a Italian mobster's voice.
I believe his official mobster name is Donny Two Scoops.
Maybe next year, maybe no go
User avatar
Isgrimnur
Posts: 82831
Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2006 12:29 am
Location: Chookity pok
Contact:

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by Isgrimnur »

Goldie Bulgegrabber?
It's almost as if people are the problem.
User avatar
TheMix
Posts: 11067
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 5:19 pm
Location: Broomfield, Colorado

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by TheMix »

Octavious wrote:Don't have time to read through it myself, but does it say that he told Trump he's not under investigation? That would tick me off it's true he told him that. I see that's what Fox News is implying.
Yes.
During the dinner, the President returned to the salacious material I had briefed him about on January 6, and, as he had done previously, expressed his disgust for the allegations and strongly denied them. He said he was considering ordering me to investigate the alleged incident to prove it didn’t happen. I replied that he should give that careful thought because it might create a narrative that we were investigating him personally, which we weren’t, and because it was very difficult to prove a negative. He said he would think about it and asked me to think about it.
Last edited by TheMix on Wed Jun 07, 2017 3:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Black Lives Matter

Isgrimnur - Facebook makes you hate your friends and family. LinkedIn makes you hate you co-workers. NextDoor makes you hate your neighbors.
User avatar
El Guapo
Posts: 41540
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2005 4:01 pm
Location: Boston

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by El Guapo »

Octavious wrote:Don't have time to read through it myself, but does it say that he told Trump he's not under investigation? That would tick me off it's true he told him that. I see that's what Fox News is implying.
Yes. Here are relevant parts:
It is important to understand that FBI counter-intelligence investigations are
different than the more-commonly known criminal investigative work. The
Bureau’s goal in a counter-intelligence investigation is to understand the technical
and human methods that hostile foreign powers are using to influence the United
States or to steal our secrets. The FBI uses that understanding to disrupt those
efforts. Sometimes disruption takes the form of alerting a person who is targeted
for recruitment or influence by the foreign power. Sometimes it involves
hardening a computer system that is being attacked. Sometimes it involves
“turning” the recruited person into a double-agent, or publicly calling out the
behavior with sanctions or expulsions of embassy-based intelligence officers. On
occasion, criminal prosecution is used to disrupt intelligence activities.

...

In that context, prior to the January 6 meeting, I discussed with the FBI’s
leadership team whether I should be prepared to assure President-Elect Trump that
we were not investigating him personally. That was true; we did not have an open
counter-intelligence case on him. We agreed I should do so if circumstances
warranted. During our one-on-one meeting at Trump Tower, based on President-
Elect Trump’s reaction to the briefing and without him directly asking the
question, I offered that assurance.

...

[On March 30]

Then the President asked why there had been a congressional hearing about
Russia the previous week – at which I had, as the Department of Justice directed,
confirmed the investigation into possible coordination between Russia and the
Trump campaign. I explained the demands from the leadership of both parties in
Congress for more information, and that Senator Grassley had even held up the
confirmation of the Deputy Attorney General until we briefed him in detail on the
investigation. I explained that we had briefed the leadership of Congress on
exactly which individuals we were investigating and that we had told those
Congressional leaders that we were not personally investigating President Trump.
I reminded him I had previously told him that. He repeatedly told me, “We need
to get that fact out.” (I did not tell the President that the FBI and the Department
of Justice had been reluctant to make public statements that we did not have an
open case on President Trump for a number of reasons, most importantly because
it would create a duty to correct, should that change.)

...

[On April 11]

On the morning of April 11, the President called me and asked what I had
done about his request that I “get out” that he is not personally under investigation.
I replied that I had passed his request to the Acting Deputy Attorney General, but I
had not heard back. He replied that “the cloud” was getting in the way of his
ability to do his job. He said that perhaps he would have his people reach out to
the Acting Deputy Attorney General. I said that was the way his request should be
handled. I said the White House Counsel should contact the leadership of DOJ to
make the request, which was the traditional channel.
Strictly speaking this is all past tense, so it's possible that there is an open investigation targeting Donald Trump now, but that there was not as of late March / early April. Also possible that his remarks were limited to saying that there was no counter-intelligence investigation, though it doesn't sound like that.

Of course, it would be really easy for an investigation of Trump's close associates (which clearly is happening) to turn into an investigation of Trump personally.
Black Lives Matter.
User avatar
El Guapo
Posts: 41540
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2005 4:01 pm
Location: Boston

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by El Guapo »

Captain Caveman wrote:
Octavious wrote:Don't have time to read through it myself, but does it say that he told Trump he's not under investigation? That would tick me off it's true he told him that. I see that's what Fox News is implying.
Yes, he told him that the investigation of collusion wasn't focused on him personally. Trump repeatedly pressures him to make this information public, but Comey declines, and notes in his statement that doing so would require him to issue a corrective if at some point Trump does become a focus.

So Trump pretty clearly obstructed justice, just not in a case against him personally. I'm not sure how that does him any favors.
It's sort of funny, though, because Trump already said in his interview with Lester Holt that he fired Comey because of the Russia investigation. He's already confessed to obstruction of justice. So for all the drama, it's hard to see how this testimony tomorrow won't be a dramatic sideshow. Republicans already know enough to impeach Trump, but they are still happy to protect him.

The only plausible bombshell that could change that, it seems to me, is when indictments start flying. Until then we're mainly trying to hold on.
Black Lives Matter.
User avatar
Captain Caveman
Posts: 11687
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 8:57 am

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by Captain Caveman »

El Guapo wrote:It's sort of funny, though, because Trump already said in his interview with Lester Holt that he fired Comey because of the Russia investigation. He's already confessed to obstruction of justice. So for all the drama, it's hard to see how this testimony tomorrow won't be a dramatic sideshow. Republicans already know enough to impeach Trump, but they are still happy to protect him.

The only plausible bombshell that could change that, it seems to me, is when indictments start flying. Until then we're mainly trying to hold on.
Comey also doesn't mention in his statement what occurred in the other phone calls with Trump he said happened, nor does he discuss any other contacts that may have occurred with others in the WH. I wonder if these omissions mean that nothing of note occurred during these interactions, or whether he's holding back some important info for some reason.
User avatar
El Guapo
Posts: 41540
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2005 4:01 pm
Location: Boston

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by El Guapo »

Combustible Lemur wrote:
malchior wrote:That exchange was very painful but I'm glad it happened. They better have a very good reason or it appears they may be acting in a lawless fashion.
None of those guys are trump appointees right? It seems most likely that those conversations are now involved in the myriad criminal investigation of the broad nebulous abyss that is the campaign, administration, and individual persons associated with the former, that may or may not be overlapping and coordinating with the special investigation.

But yeah, I agree that it's one of those conversations that needs to happen publicly.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk
Trump appointed Coats. Rogers is a holdover though.

I had forgotten before googling this that a couple people had recommended to Obama that he fire Rogers during the transition (obviously he decided against that).
The Washington Post reported on 19 November 2016 that Defense Secretary Ashton B. Carter and Director of National Intelligence (DNI) James R. Clapper Jr. had recommended to President Obama that Rogers be terminated as director of the National Security Agency. Carter reportedly recommended he be terminated due to poor performance, whereas Clapper considered it wise that the position be held by a civilian. Both Clapper and Carter had put Rogers on notice for poor performance in internal security and for a poor leadership style. His termination was reportedly delayed due to stalled changes to the bureaucratic structure of the intelligence community. Later, Rogers reportedly met with then President-elect Donald Trump without notifying his supervisors in what is an unprecedented action for a military officer. Trump was reportedly considering replacing Clapper with Rogers as DNI, however that position went to former Senator Dan Coats, with Rogers remaining NSA director.[13]
Black Lives Matter.
User avatar
El Guapo
Posts: 41540
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2005 4:01 pm
Location: Boston

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by El Guapo »

Captain Caveman wrote:
El Guapo wrote:It's sort of funny, though, because Trump already said in his interview with Lester Holt that he fired Comey because of the Russia investigation. He's already confessed to obstruction of justice. So for all the drama, it's hard to see how this testimony tomorrow won't be a dramatic sideshow. Republicans already know enough to impeach Trump, but they are still happy to protect him.

The only plausible bombshell that could change that, it seems to me, is when indictments start flying. Until then we're mainly trying to hold on.
Comey also doesn't mention in his statement what occurred in the other phone calls with Trump he said happened, nor does he discuss any other contacts that may have occurred with others in the WH. I wonder if these omissions mean that nothing of note occurred during these interactions, or whether he's holding back some important info for some reason.
Hard to say. Comey can't and won't say anything about what's going on with the FBI investigations that are underway, and presumably there are other confidential topics of conversation that they could have been talking about.
Black Lives Matter.
User avatar
El Guapo
Posts: 41540
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2005 4:01 pm
Location: Boston

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by El Guapo »

Also interesting that Comey says that he didn't want to say publicly that Trump wasn't under investigation in case that later changed.
Black Lives Matter.
User avatar
PLW
Posts: 3058
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 11:39 am
Location: Clemson

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by PLW »

El Guapo wrote:Also interesting that Comey says that he didn't want to say publicly that Trump wasn't under investigation in case that later changed.
Well, part of his reasoning is that he would have a responsibility to publicly correct if Trump came under investigation. Now that he is no longer the Director, that reason is moot.
User avatar
El Guapo
Posts: 41540
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2005 4:01 pm
Location: Boston

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by El Guapo »

PLW wrote:
El Guapo wrote:Also interesting that Comey says that he didn't want to say publicly that Trump wasn't under investigation in case that later changed.
Well, part of his reasoning is that he would have a responsibility to publicly correct if Trump came under investigation. Now that he is no longer the Director, that reason is moot.
Right, that was his logic (at least part of it) for not publicly stating that Trump wasn't personally under investigation at the time (March 30th). It's possible that Trump came under investigation between then and when Comey was fired. It's also possible Trump came under investigation after Comey was fired, although presumably Comey's ability to find that out would be limited.
Black Lives Matter.
User avatar
El Guapo
Posts: 41540
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2005 4:01 pm
Location: Boston

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by El Guapo »

Black Lives Matter.
User avatar
Captain Caveman
Posts: 11687
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 8:57 am

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by Captain Caveman »

Maybe Trump was on the level denying involvement with Russian hookers. Maybe he knew that they were Ukrainian.
User avatar
Holman
Posts: 29185
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2004 8:00 pm
Location: Between the Schuylkill and the Wissahickon

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by Holman »

The best part is that he didn't order any hookers because he always assumed he was being recorded in Russia.

"Melania, baby, you gotta understand--THAT weekend I was in Chicago. Nobody records you in Chicago!"
Much prefer my Nazis Nuremberged.
User avatar
Kurth
Posts: 6082
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2005 1:19 am
Location: Portland

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by Kurth »

Maxine Waters: "So Comey told Jeff Sessions he didn't want to be alone with Trump. Women across the country can relate."

Too perfect.
Just 'cause you feel it, doesn't mean it's there -- Radiohead
Do you believe me? Do you trust me? Do you like me? 😳
User avatar
Unagi
Posts: 26762
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2006 5:14 pm
Location: Chicago

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by Unagi »

User avatar
Unagi
Posts: 26762
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2006 5:14 pm
Location: Chicago

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by Unagi »

These guys are trying to say they want to talk - but have some squeamish reason not to.
User avatar
Holman
Posts: 29185
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2004 8:00 pm
Location: Between the Schuylkill and the Wissahickon

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by Holman »

Unagi wrote:These guys are trying to say they want to talk - but have some squeamish reason not to.
Yeah, it was weird.

Liberals were frustrated because they hoped for a grand "J'accuse," but that's not how these things work.

Conservatives who believe that the evasions somehow exonerate Trump are missing how simple and easy a "No" would have been. If there were nothing to see here, everyone testifying today could have made that very clear very easily.
link
Much prefer my Nazis Nuremberged.
User avatar
Unagi
Posts: 26762
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2006 5:14 pm
Location: Chicago

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by Unagi »

Yes,


Just - YES


The world needs new CAPITAL LETTERS
User avatar
Defiant
Posts: 21045
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:09 pm
Location: Tongue in cheek

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by Defiant »

El Guapo wrote:
Well, to be fair, Disney eliminated the Russian hookers working Times Square by then.
User avatar
Smoove_B
Posts: 55014
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 12:58 am
Location: Kaer Morhen

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by Smoove_B »

Did he actually read the whole thing?
Trump's personal lawyer said Trump was cheered by the testimony.

"The president is pleased that Mr. Comey has finally publicly confirmed his private reports that the president was not under investigation in any Russian probe," attorney Mark Kasowitz said in a statement. "The president feels completely and totally vindicated. He is eager to continue to move forward with his agenda."
Maybe next year, maybe no go
User avatar
Holman
Posts: 29185
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2004 8:00 pm
Location: Between the Schuylkill and the Wissahickon

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by Holman »

Tomorrow's tweets will be a hoot.
Much prefer my Nazis Nuremberged.
User avatar
naednek
Posts: 10905
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 9:23 pm

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by naednek »

Image
hepcat - "I agree with Naednek"
User avatar
El Guapo
Posts: 41540
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2005 4:01 pm
Location: Boston

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by El Guapo »

The RNC has sent out Comey talking points to Republicans. Here's a summary.

Best part - point 1 is "Comey's statement vindicates Trump". Last point: "Comey is a liar who can't be trusted."
Black Lives Matter.
User avatar
$iljanus
Forum Moderator
Posts: 13701
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 3:46 pm
Location: New England...or under your bed

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by $iljanus »

If only VH1 covered the hearing...

James Comey: The Popup Video Special.

Various fake cable news channels have talking heads commenting on the upcoming hearing but Fox News was reporting on the real news of the day such as FLOTUS moving into the White House and country music stars gathering for the CMT awards. I'm sure they'll air something about Comey the Traitor sometime today. :lol:
Black lives matter!

Wise words of warning from Smoove B: Oh, how you all laughed when I warned you about the semen. Well, who's laughing now?
User avatar
El Guapo
Posts: 41540
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2005 4:01 pm
Location: Boston

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by El Guapo »

David Frum:
Black Lives Matter.
User avatar
YellowKing
Posts: 30382
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 2:02 pm

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by YellowKing »

Yeah it's amazing how two parties can look at the same statements and draw a completely opposing set of conclusions.

However, it's very clear that the conservative spin relies on pointing out a "win" on a point nobody actually cared about. Common tactic - seize on some point of minutiae that proves your point while ignoring the bulk of the evidence that doesn't fit your agenda.
User avatar
El Guapo
Posts: 41540
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2005 4:01 pm
Location: Boston

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by El Guapo »

I do find it interesting how Comey's statement spends several paragraphs on the distinction between counter-intelligence and ordinary criminal investigations (a distinction that doesn't really come up in the rest of the statement) before getting to this part:
In that context, prior to the January 6 meeting, I discussed with the FBI’s leadership team whether I should be prepared to assure President-Elect Trump that we were not investigating him personally. That was true; we did not have an open counter-intelligence case on him.
There are just a staggering amount of qualifiers there.
Black Lives Matter.
User avatar
Rip
Posts: 26891
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 9:34 pm
Location: Cajun Country!
Contact:

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by Rip »

Nothingburger is loaded with nothingsauce.
User avatar
hepcat
Posts: 52203
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 3:02 pm
Location: Chicago, IL Home of the triple homicide!

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by hepcat »

Just like Benghazi.

sorry, misspelled that.

BENGHAZI!
Now depoliticized.
User avatar
LordMortis
Posts: 70478
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:26 pm

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by LordMortis »

Rip wrote:Nothingburger is loaded with nothingsauce.
Your loyalty will be rewarded. Please donate to Trump foundation.
Last edited by LordMortis on Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:51 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Zarathud
Posts: 16674
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 10:29 pm
Location: Chicago, Illinois

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by Zarathud »

Still looks and tastes like shit. Not swallowing it.

The whole argument is stupid -- it's like saying Al Capone must be innocent because they haven't investigated him yet. Or after they convicted him, it was only for tax fraud.
"A lie can run round the world before the truth has got its boots on." -Terry Pratchett, The Truth
"The presence of those seeking the truth is infinitely to be preferred to those who think they've found it." -Terry Pratchett, Monstrous Regiment
User avatar
hepcat
Posts: 52203
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 3:02 pm
Location: Chicago, IL Home of the triple homicide!

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by hepcat »

Well...I DID notice that Al Capone was never mentioned once during these interviews. :think:

Anyway, where was I?

Oh yeah...

BENGHAZI!
Now depoliticized.
User avatar
LordMortis
Posts: 70478
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:26 pm

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by LordMortis »

hepcat wrote:Well...I DID notice that Al Capone was never mentioned once during these interviews. :think:

Chewbacca does not make sense!
User avatar
hepcat
Posts: 52203
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 3:02 pm
Location: Chicago, IL Home of the triple homicide!

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by hepcat »

Trump tweet that already? I thought he was saving that as a finisher.
Now depoliticized.
User avatar
Blackhawk
Posts: 44704
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 9:48 pm
Location: Southwest Indiana

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by Blackhawk »

:pop:
(˙pǝsɹǝʌǝɹ uǝǝq sɐɥ ʎʇıʌɐɹƃ ʃɐuosɹǝd ʎW)
User avatar
El Guapo
Posts: 41540
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2005 4:01 pm
Location: Boston

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by El Guapo »

Black Lives Matter.
User avatar
Smoove_B
Posts: 55014
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 12:58 am
Location: Kaer Morhen

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by Smoove_B »

The former director of the FBI is indicating "the nature of the person" is why he documented the details of his conversations with the President.

That's some nothingburger.
Maybe next year, maybe no go
User avatar
PLW
Posts: 3058
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 11:39 am
Location: Clemson

Re: The Trump Investigation Thread

Post by PLW »

Smoove_B wrote:The former director of the FBI is indicating "the nature of the person" is why he documented the details of his conversations with the President.

That's some nothingburger.
Except it kind of is. Everyone knows already that Trump has a tenuous relationship with the truth.
Post Reply