[HBOMax] Raised by Wolves

[hepcat]

So as not to crowd the general HBO thread with specific show discussions, I’m creating a thread for what has become one of my favorite science fiction shows. It’s called Raised by Wolves, it’s on its second season, it’s quite well reviewed, and the plot synopsis reads thusly:

After Earth is torn apart by religious differences and the human race teeters on the edge of extinction, an atheistic android architect sends two creations - Mother and Father - to start a peaceful, godless colony on the planet Kepler-22b. From executive producer Ridley Scott, Raised by Wolves follows Mother and Father as they attempt to raise human children in this mysterious virgin land - a treacherous and difficult task that's jeopardized by the arrival of the Mithraic, a deeply devout religious order of surviving humans. As the androids make contact with this zealous and dangerous people, they struggle to control the beliefs of their fiercely self-determining children.

But that’s like saying Dune is about giant worms. This show is original, imaginative and completely bat shit insane. It follows no rules and god bless it for that. I tune in every week without a clue what it’s going to toss at me.

It’s not for everyone. It’s more like the science fiction movies of the late 60s and early 70s, or like a Bradbury science fiction/dark fantasy tale. It can be jarring to those who go in expecting the usual tropes of the genre, or prefer a more grounded story.

Spoilers

Spoiler:

So this 2nd season has given us ancient alien vampire robot, a potentially sentient flying snake, what may actually be a god (more specifically, Sol), an acid ocean….and father as Tyler Durden.

I suspect the “god” is some ancient alien who is pulling the strings behind the scenes, but who knows with this show.

The ancient alien robot vampire is what intrigues me the most.

I particularly like that with the introduction of the Atheist colony this season, we find that they’ve effectively created a god for themselves. The dichotomy is interesting.

[Kraken]

This might be my next me-show, after I finish Station 11 (three more episodes to go). Wife's on the verge of cautiously resuming some of her pre-pandemic social activities, which will give me some time to watch TV alone, at least until the next covid surge shuts us down again.

[Rumpy]

Could have sworn there was already a thread on this when the first season was running. It's hiding somewhere. Or maybe it's just in the HBOMax thread.

Either way, I'm going to give season 2 a pass. I really liked the art design of the first season , but it just got weirder and weirder as it went on and by the time the season ended, I wasn't sure what I was watching.

[hepcat]

Either way, I'm going to give season 2 a pass. I really liked the art design of the first season , but it just got weirder and weirder as it went on and by the time the season ended, I wasn't sure what I was watching.

Yup. That's one of the selling points I mentioned.

Everything will get explained, but at its own pace. This show doesn't spoon feed you answers. It waits until it makes sense to reveal answers. Most current science fiction won't introduce such things without dumbing it down and making it obvious what's happening almost immediately. RbW makes you wait until the right moment.

[Rumpy]

Nah, it's not about the dumbing down. I just find I can't get behind the concept. It's too.. abstract.

[Smoove_B]

I think I'm on Ep4 of S1. I'm really liking it, but it's like watching Legion (best I can compare) in that I have to be 100% focused and paying attention. If my mind drifts or I nod off for 30 seconds, something major likely happened and now I'm wondering why there's a shadow monster playing pinochle with a church choir in zero gravity at a Wild West themed saloon.

[hepcat]

Nah, it's not about the dumbing down. I just find I can't get behind the concept. It's too.. abstract.

Everything they've shown has eventually had a concrete explanation, or the promise of one to come. I don't see abstraction at all, I just see a show that won't follow normal trends by immediately satisfying viewers with easy answers to every plot point. You have to pay attention and be patient. The story is unfolding at ITS pace and that can be annoying for people, I'm sure.

The biggest complaint I read amongst the reviews is that it can come off as cold and clinical in its atmosphere. I kind of agree with that. But I'm not sure the story they're telling could be told in a different fashion.

and now I'm wondering why there's a shadow monster playing pinochle with a church choir in zero gravity at a Wild West themed saloon.

Ah, you saw episode 3 of season 1!

But in all seriousness...you ain't even arrived at the weirdest stop on your trip with this show. Hell, I don't even think there IS a stop. That train just keeps on pulling into the station each week.

...thank god.

[$iljanus]

It's a small thing but I was amused when Mother was lined up to get her job marble of the day and she just eats it. I was all WTF but realized that Mother and Father have no pants so where else would they have put it?

[hepcat]

I was going to comment on that. I love that they use their bodies as travel bags. Then they just regurgitate whatever they swallowed when they need it. I mean, it makes perfect sense. They're androids, they don't digest things, so why not use that space for storage. But yeah, it makes me chuckle every time.

About the latest episode:

Spoiler:

So Marcus had literally swallowed Mother's eyes and THAT'S what was making him all bad ass and immune? I'm curious as to how that could be. I wonder if they'll explain that. I do love that they left us wondering what the hell was going on with Marcus for 3 or 4 episodes, then bam...we get that reveal out of the blue.

But more importantly, the necromancer is back, baby!

[Rumpy]

Nah, it's not about the dumbing down. I just find I can't get behind the concept. It's too.. abstract.

Everything they've shown has eventually had a concrete explanation, or the promise of one to come. I don't see abstraction at all, I just see a show that won't follow normal trends by immediately satisfying viewers with easy answers to every plot point. You have to pay attention and be patient. The story is unfolding at ITS pace and that can be annoying for people, I'm sure.

Agree to disagree on that front. I didn't see anything there that made it feel worth it for me to continue watching it. I have too many shows on the backburner and unfortunately this is one of the casualties.

[hepcat]

Fair enough. Life's too short to waste on something you don't enjoy. That's why I gave up self flagellation.

[LordMortis]

Fair enough. Life's too short to waste on something you don't enjoy. That's why I gave up self flagellation.

And why I refuse to give up on self flatulation... except when I'm around people... Damned you people getting in way of relief!

[Isgrimnur]

Fair enough. Life's too short to waste on something you don't enjoy. That's why I gave up self flagellation.

I'm sorry to hear your OnlyFans where you do it in Doug Dimmadome, owner of the Dimmsdale Dimmadome, cosplay didn't work out.

[hepcat]

I had to look that up. You know my site was dedicated to Charles Nelson Reilly cosplay, man. Especially his Lidsville years.

[Isgrimnur]

I was going for the Scarlet Letter crossover

[Zaxxon]

I just watched S1E1. Wow.

Why didn't anyone tell me about this show before now? Like, at least a few weeks prior, maybe as part of a megathread?

[Smoove_B]

Did you enjoy their quasi futuristic clothes? I designed them myself.

(that's all I think about when I see Mother and Father)

[Zaxxon]

6 episodes in. Still hooked.

Spoiler:

Dark photons, you say?

Tally taught you, you say?

[hepcat]

Congratulations, you're just about past the normal stuff!

While I was watching the latest episode, I started thinking of Harlan Ellison. This seems like the kind of thing he'd have written.

[Hamlet3145]

Is is weird that of all the weird things in this show, the weirdest thing to me is how mother . . .

Spoiler:

. . . stores her spare eyeballs in her mouth?

[ImLawBoy]

She doesn't have pockets!

[Zaxxon]

The explanation for that one is simple, and I know it because I just saw it in the episode I referenced above.

Spoiler:

She didn't always store them there, and it bit her majorly in ep 6.

[Zaxxon]

Finished S1. On board for S2. I've been wallowing in how bad the Ars crew (including most commenters) think it was. Most of the stuff being complained about seemed well-explained to me...

Spoiler:

One example: folks complaining that Monther was somehow impregnated by a program from her creator/programmer, who then changed her mission to raise this serpent-baby. That seems like a terrible read to me. I think it's pretty clear that Mother was impregnated by the world's mondo-lizard-alien-osaurus-people while she was in the sim and unable to perceive the real world, and that the mission-changy-sexytime bits were also orchestrated by the aliens.

Just like they're complaining about Atheist King Dude having found religion, when it seems pretty clear that 'Sol' is the aliens.
I mean, they even explained that the Mithraic don't even understand the Necromancer tech fully, for flying serpent baby's sake. Pay attention, people--there's more going on here!

I could go on, but I just don't get the accusations that the show is off the rails in a bad way. I've found the progression so far to actually be pretty well-written and off the rails in a good way. (In that even the 'crazy' twists have in-show explanations/hints previously given.)

Entirely possible that S2 will make me look silly. This far, I'm agreeing with hepcat's take that this is old-school-ish sci-fi targeting a different demo from most current stuff, and that it doesn't suffer foolspeople multitasking while watching.

[hepcat]

They had some valid complaints, I think. But I also believe they’re too early with them. The show, as you noted, does eventually get around to answering questions. So I think we’ll get the reasons for most, if not all their questions that frustrated them.

But even if it doesn’t, I also tend to view the show as also a sort of Ray Bradbury dark fantasy at times. So some of the things like

Spoiler:

How can a giant snake fly

may be something we have to accept without scientific reasons. Although I suspect that, in this case

Spoiler:

They’ve already told us the serpent is bio mechanical in nature, and was formed in Mother….who CAN fly. So it’s not that far out of the realm of reason that Snakey absorbed/learned that ability while creating itself and incorporated that.

[Zaxxon]

Yep.

[hepcat]

Did you enjoy their quasi futuristic clothes? I designed them myself.

(that's all I think about when I see Mother and Father)

It's been almost an entire week now, and I still cannot get the image of the entire Smoove family going about their daily routines clad in skin tight, shiny, silver body suits.

There's smoove making parent teacher night uncomfortable for everyone. And there's the smoove family dog at the park scaring kids because it looks like a four legged bullet.

It just won't stop.

[Smoove_B]

[Zaxxon]

They've been referring to each other solely as 'Mother' and 'Father' since before it was cool.

[hepcat]

They're Amish androids.

How's THAT for an oxymoron?

[Holman]

I just finished Season 1 and found it pretty compelling (if a little slow).

There were plenty of twists in the story and plenty that remains unexplained, but I have to assume that Ridley Scott & company have the whole arc mapped out better than, say, the Battlestar Galactica reboot did.

Some questions/reactions (although I request no Season 2 spoilers):

Spoiler:

I assume the backstory is alternate history? Mithras and Sol Invictus were worshiped in ancient Rome by cults that competed with early Christianity. Presumably this is a world where they became the official Imperial religion and then the world-dominant one. (I guess the alternative is that Mithraic religion had some sort of resurgence in the 21st/22nd century.)

It's been hinted that the secrets of Mithraic technology (including the Necromancers and FTL drive) were derived from their scriptures, so I guess we should expect to hear that aliens meddled in Earth's history, not just on Kepler 22b. That is, unless Sol is 100% real.

The androids' milky blood and the appearance of the humanoid alien in s1 e10 (which resembles a stunted Engineer/Space Jockey) suggest that this story takes place in the universe of the Alien movies, although obviously the Earth backstory doesn't line up. Is this just homage?

What exactly happened when the androids flew the lander down a hole in s1 e10? It *looks* like they went into the magma and punched all the way through the planet, coming out the other side. Surely we're not supposed to think that happened, are we? Earthlike planetary cores just aren't like that.

[hepcat]

Spoiler:

I don’t think it’s as elaborate as an alternate history, but I could be wrong (and usually am about this show). I think it’s just a Dune like future where so much time has passed that things have…changed. A new religion based on ancient material probably sprung up during that time and took hold.

Question 2: no clue, but I’m sure answers will be eventually revealed.

Question 3: I suspect homage.

Question 4: They established early on that the ancient, snake like inhabitants of the planet had created all those tunnels. I think we’re going to find out more about why in future episodes. I’ve even read one review that tries to tie some other events from season 1 into a theory they’re time rifts.

[Holman]

Spoiler:

I don’t think it’s as elaborate as an alternate history, but I could be wrong (and usually am about this show). I think it’s just a Dune like future where so much time has passed that things have…changed. A new religion based on ancient material probably sprung up during that time and took hold.

Spoiler:

I think we're told it's the mid-22nd century. I seem to recall seeing the date 2145 on a flashback to the war on Earth.

(Of course it would be weird to use AD dates in a Mithraic timeline, but dating from the beginning of the Roman empire would be just a few decades off from that. Or maybe it's just for viewer convenience.)

[hepcat]

Ah, I forgot they do mention 22nd century in the ads for the show.

Its a general gripe on my part, but I wish they’d set these shows a little further into the future. The 22nd century really isn’t that far off.

[Zaxxon]

The showrunner did confirm in an interview that

Spoiler:

they did actually fly through the center of the planet.

[hepcat]

In a review for one of the latest episodes, the critic noted that everyone should be afraid because

Spoiler:

Now androids can lie

[Smoove_B]

I'm trying desperately to catch up, but I'm also trying to not just blast through everything and miss something. I'm done with the first seven episodes of S1 and I'm genuinely intrigued to see where this is all going.

I still think it's really well written. They slowly expand the scope, move the story forward and resolve some things while then slowly adding in new, crazy-insane elements that have me wanting to learn more.

It like...if the writers from LOST actually did their job.

[hepcat]

And no golden sewer!

[rittchard]

It like...if the writers from LOST actually did their job.

Side discussion: I think I may be one of the few hardcore Lost fans, I think I've seen the whole series like 3 times. There are some lulls and goofs for sure, but as a whole I still really loved it. Also I don't think it's fair to compare a network show from that era with any streaming show from this one. The scheduling issues, the pressure for ratings, the entire development process... it just can't be compared. Having the kind of freedom in budget and schedule (at least from the public eye perspective) to create 8-10 episodes and a fairly random release schedule which doesn't seem to owe fans any explanation - compare that to writing/filming 20+ episodes in a set few months every year with a network breathing down your neck for more. The Lost folk admitted they were forced to extend the show without planned storylines, and it showed during the middle of the series. Then for those of us that remember, they had horrible scheduling with things like one week on two weeks off, then one episode or two then another break. It was really horrible for fans and they lost (no pun intended) a lot of fan interest during that period. It went from being "watercooler" event TV to total confusion. Anyway, just some soapboxy thoughts.

As for RBW, I really do enjoy the show, it continues to surprise and keep me on my toes, which I love.

[Combustible Lemur]

It like...if the writers from LOST actually did their job.

Side discussion: I think I may be one of the few hardcore Lost fans, I think I've seen the whole series like 3 times. There are some lulls and goofs for sure, but as a whole I still really loved it. Also I don't think it's fair to compare a network show from that era with any streaming show from this one. The scheduling issues, the pressure for ratings, the entire development process... it just can't be compared. Having the kind of freedom in budget and schedule (at least from the public eye perspective) to create 8-10 episodes and a fairly random release schedule which doesn't seem to owe fans any explanation - compare that to writing/filming 20+ episodes in a set few months every year with a network breathing down your neck for more. The Lost folk admitted they were forced to extend the show without planned storylines, and it showed during the middle of the series. Then for those of us that remember, they had horrible scheduling with things like one week on two weeks off, then one episode or two then another break. It was really horrible for fans and they lost (no pun intended) a lot of fan interest during that period. It went from being "watercooler" event TV to total confusion. Anyway, just some soapboxy thoughts.

As for RBW, I really do enjoy the show, it continues to surprise and keep me on my toes, which I love.

I'm in your boat., My only real gripe but I didn't actually mind because "what else are you going to say."
D&D S1 " They're absolutely not in purgatory.
Finale: They've definitely been in purgatory the whole time " at least since they set off the first big jump.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk

[Smoove_B]

Yes, that's all fair. It was the first show that came to mind that was similar in...feel (?) - where there was science and spiritual weirdness and a larger mystery poking at the periphery. But yeah, that was a different era of TV and it was on a network channel, not a cable show.

Also, I want to thank the writers of Raised by Wolves for a childhood nightmare flashback from seeing Poltergeist in the movie theater during the opening scene of Ep8 with the scalpel. Also, the medical bot? Nightmare.