Octopus Overlords

Jaymann wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 12:50 pmHere is what I don't get about the USPS slowdown strategy:

I think the theory is that densely populated areas, which are historically Democratic, will be less inclined to in-person voting because they've seen first hand what happens with COVID-19 and may try to mail-in ballots more. Rural areas, which tend to drift more Republican, will be less inclined to mail-in voting because they've largely been spared the worst effects of the virus so far.

If the country were an evenly spread population and demographic, it wouldn't matter at all in the end... but we're not, and it does.

Here's another take. Let's not forget those rural areas actually rely heavily on the postal service and they're already getting screwed by Trump's policies. What blows my mind is that the man can ruin their trade-reliant jobs, try and abolish their healthcare, and break their lifeline to the outside world - and they still prefer that to "Those Goddamn Liberals"...

Wife and I got our mail in ballots today! Yea democracy in the state of Massachusetts! I think it might have taken almost two weeks from when they were dropped in the mail and I discovered that you can check the status of your mail in ballot request online. (Was pending as of yesterday) Yea Massachusetts again!

Jaymann wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 12:50 pm Here is what I don't get about the USPS slowdown strategy:

If say the split is 55% Biden to 45% Trump, and you reduce that number of votes cast by mail, don't the percentages stay the same? I suppose you could selectively slow down in strong Democratic areas, but I'm not sure how you do that at the national level.

But if the mail-in vote split differs from the in-person vote split, then you are selectively harming one candidate. In your example, if the mail-in votes are 55% Biden to 45% Trump but the in-person votes are 51% Trump 49% Biden and you stop 1 million mail-in votes from being cast, that harms Biden much more than it harms Trump. He effectively would lose out on a 100,000 vote gain on Trump.

$iljanus wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 1:00 pmWife and I got our mail in ballots today!

Better mail those back as soon as possible to make sure they're counted before November 3rd. Apparently 32 states won't even look at a mail-in ballot if it arrives after the deadline, even if postmarked before.

Jaymann wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 12:50 pm Here is what I don't get about the USPS slowdown strategy:

If say the split is 55% Biden to 45% Trump, and you reduce that number of votes cast by mail, don't the percentages stay the same? I suppose you could selectively slow down in strong Democratic areas, but I'm not sure how you do that at the national level.

So historically there's not much evidence that mail in voting has favored one party versus another. HOWEVER, this is a pretty unique situation, and Trump can impact the likely breakdown by what he says and does. By pushing the narratives of: (1) mail in voting is fraudulent, and (2) coronavirus risks are overstated / a hoax / etc., Trump can motivate his voters to vote disproportionately in person (and Biden supporters are more likely to take coronavirus risks seriously). So maybe he can get the percentages up to like mail in ballots being 70% - 80% Biden, and then do everything he can to mess up mail in voting so that it disproportionately impacts Biden.

On top of that, I wouldn't be surprised if he / state GOP officials try to process mail-in ballots differently that are coming from GOP areas vs. Democratic areas, though I haven't seen much on that so that's a little more speculative.

ALSO, to the extent that he can get the mail in voting systems to break down, he and state GOP officials can then make in person voting easier in GOP areas than in Democratic areas.

$iljanus wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 1:00 pm Wife and I got our mail in ballots today! Yea democracy in the state of Massachusetts! I think it might have taken almost two weeks from when they were dropped in the mail and I discovered that you can check the status of your mail in ballot request online. (Was pending as of yesterday) Yea Massachusetts again!

Just checked. We dropped out primary ballots in the mail on Saturday. Still showing up as "not returned" currently, but it's only been a few days, so we'll see.

Paingod wrote:

$iljanus wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 1:00 pmWife and I got our mail in ballots today!

Better mail those back as soon as possible to make sure they're counted before November 3rd. Apparently 32 states won't even look at a mail-in ballot if it arrives after the deadline, even if postmarked before.

I should clarify and say it's the state ballot. The Federal one won't go out until after everyone is officially nominated.

In the meantime, I need to choose between Joe Kennedy or Ed Markey for Senate.

$iljanus wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 1:00 pm Wife and I got our mail in ballots today! Yea democracy in the state of Massachusetts! I think it might have taken almost two weeks from when they were dropped in the mail and I discovered that you can check the status of your mail in ballot request online. (Was pending as of yesterday) Yea Massachusetts again!

Ours arrived on Monday. Today, I spent an hour reading up on the candidates for the non-marquee offices, such as county commissioner. This is probably the best-informed ballot I've ever cast thanks to having leisure time with it at home.

Our town hall set up a dropbox for ballots, and I walk past it once or twice a week.

Blackhawk wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 11:13 am I applied for mail-in ballots for me and my son a while back. I'm starting to regret that now.

If you don't receive the ballot, you should be able to print one online. Once you have the ballot, you can always drop it off at a ballot drop box. Assuming it's like WA, which I would really hope it is.

Colorado has been doing all mail-in ballots for years, but they do have the law where the ballot must be either postmarked or dropped off at a precinct no later than 7pm on election day. They are very good about providing lots of drop-off boxes (at least in metro areas, I don't know about rural areas or mountain towns).

I always drop our ballots off at the City & County building dropbox, since it's literally 5 minutes away. Our city (town? suburb? whatever) is also now using BallotTrax, so I can sign up to get an email notifying me that my ballot was reviewed, accepted, and counted (which I did after dropping off my primary ballot earlier this year).

Drop-off boxes are a great way to circumvent Trump's USPS slowdown.

Jaymann wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 3:09 pm Drop-off boxes are a great way to circumvent Trump's USPS slowdown.

More are being manufactured.

I can't help but shake the feeling that we're seeing a quick, last-ditch effort (go after USPS) to try and sabotage an election that was already targeted for interference. Much easier to screw with election equipment and gerrymandering than to try and stop voting via a mailed ballot. The idea that Trump (and the GOP) are actively targeting the method through which national elected officials are determined should truly be causing a much larger level of social outcry, imho.

I think there's outcry. I'm seeing it in the news, all over the web.

Can people start protesting because of a possibility, or do they need to wait for it to come to fruition?

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 3:15 pm

Jaymann wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 3:09 pm Drop-off boxes are a great way to circumvent Trump's USPS slowdown.

More are being manufactured.

I can't help but shake the feeling that we're seeing a quick, last-ditch effort (go after USPS) to try and sabotage an election that was already targeted for interference. Much easier to screw with election equipment and gerrymandering than to try and stop voting via a mailed ballot. The idea that Trump (and the GOP) are actively targeting the method through which national elected officials are determined should truly be causing a much larger level of social outcry, imho.

The tragicomic aspect of this is that the 'benign' explanation for the USPS fuckery is that the new Postmaster General is fucking with the USPS to enrich himself, rather than to interfere with the election.

El Guapo wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 3:33 pm

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 3:15 pm

Jaymann wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 3:09 pm Drop-off boxes are a great way to circumvent Trump's USPS slowdown.

More are being manufactured.

I can't help but shake the feeling that we're seeing a quick, last-ditch effort (go after USPS) to try and sabotage an election that was already targeted for interference. Much easier to screw with election equipment and gerrymandering than to try and stop voting via a mailed ballot. The idea that Trump (and the GOP) are actively targeting the method through which national elected officials are determined should truly be causing a much larger level of social outcry, imho.

The tragicomic aspect of this is that the 'benign' explanation for the USPS fuckery is that the new Postmaster General is fucking with the USPS to enrich himself, rather than to interfere with the election.

El Guapo wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 3:33 pm

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 3:15 pm

Jaymann wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 3:09 pm Drop-off boxes are a great way to circumvent Trump's USPS slowdown.

More are being manufactured.

I can't help but shake the feeling that we're seeing a quick, last-ditch effort (go after USPS) to try and sabotage an election that was already targeted for interference. Much easier to screw with election equipment and gerrymandering than to try and stop voting via a mailed ballot. The idea that Trump (and the GOP) are actively targeting the method through which national elected officials are determined should truly be causing a much larger level of social outcry, imho.

The tragicomic aspect of this is that the 'benign' explanation for the USPS fuckery is that the new Postmaster General is fucking with the USPS to enrich himself, rather than to interfere with the election.

"Are you cutting off my finger?"
"Actually, what I'm doing is not cutting off your arm!"

Jaymann wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 3:09 pm Drop-off boxes are a great way to circumvent Trump's USPS slowdown.

Unless your Secretary of State restricts the number of drop-boxes allowed...

El Guapo wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 3:33 pmThe tragicomic aspect of this is that the 'benign' explanation for the USPS fuckery is that the new Postmaster General is fucking with the USPS to enrich himself, rather than to interfere with the election.

Ralph-Wiggum wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 3:51 pm

Jaymann wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 3:09 pm Drop-off boxes are a great way to circumvent Trump's USPS slowdown.

Unless your Secretary of State restricts the number of drop-boxes allowed...

Spoiler:

Here it is: Ohio Sec of State just spelled out a restriction to the location of drop boxes that appears nowhere in Ohio statute: “Boards of elections are prohibited from installing a drop box at any other location but the board of elections.”

An absolute disgrace.

This really isn't as nefarious as the twitter poster makes it sound and it actually expands on absentee ballot submission from prior to 2020. First of all in Ohio most boards of election are located in the county seat. Most county seats are centrally located within the county's geographic region. Meaning wherever you are in the county you probably aren't more than 20 miles from the drop box. The requirement that the box be monitored 24/7 makes complete sense, this prevents people from tampering with or steeling the ballots.

The provision that boards of election only have the one drop box available makes sense for several reasons: 1. The drop boxes have to be made and available to each board of election 2. Adding more at this point would no doubt lead to disproportionate use of the boxes. Some counties might have 10, others may only have 3. This method ensures that every county has the same drop box access and everyone knows where to go to utilize it. There is no guess work. 4. Good luck policing and monitoring drop boxes placed all over the county. Boards of election simply don't have the man power to do that.

My county for example has a drop box that will be placed outside the door to the court house (the board of elections is in the courthouse). This spot is also monitored 24.7 by several cameras and by Sheriff Deputies.

I really don't see the problem here. The mandate has made it so that if you want to vote in Ohio by absentee ballot or early voting ballot you can do so 24/7. You simply have to drive, walk, run, or in my county ride a horse to the courthouse and drop the ballot in a box.

I forgot to mention, that nothing in that Directive prevents someone from just mailing their ballot back. It just adds one more option to be able to submit the ballots via drop box.

That puts a disproportionate burden on the poor who are less likely to be able to find the time and means to get to the county seats. Having them spread throughout the county certainly raises other burdens, as you mentioned, but would allow for more equitable access.

Alefroth wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 2:59 pm

Blackhawk wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 11:13 am I applied for mail-in ballots for me and my son a while back. I'm starting to regret that now.

If you don't receive the ballot, you should be able to print one online. Once you have the ballot, you can always drop it off at a ballot drop box. Assuming it's like WA, which I would really hope it is.

I'd be surprised. The Governor has gone out of his way to avoid increasing mail-in voting for this election. Now his position is that it isn't appropriate to make that kind of decision on the fly. He did say that it would be something to bring up with the General Assembly.

Which meets in January.

Hopefully Governor Fuckhead will just be Mr. Fuckhead by then. I'm sure it'll happen. He's only up by 43 points right now.

And to be honest, I've never actually seen a ballot drop box. Ever. I can't even find references to Indiana having them.

Blackhawk wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 4:34 pm And to be honest, I've never actually seen a ballot drop box. Ever. I can't even find references to Indiana having them.

Ohio didn't have them either, until this year. I think it's a relatively new thing for our neck of the woods.

I am in Oregon. There is a ballot drop box on the sidewalk in a nearby shopping area. Its right next to a post office drop box.

I got an absentee ballot application in the mail today from the Trump campaign, which was sort of ironic. On the front they highlighted on of Trump's tweets saying absentee ballot voting was safe because you had to follow a proper procedure (the rest of the tweet was blurred out, so I assume it was the back half of Trump's sentence contradicting the first half.)

I'm torn between tossing it in the trash or actually using it to request an absentee ballot to vote for Biden.

Jaymon wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 4:42 pm I am in Oregon. There is a ballot drop box on the sidewalk in a nearby shopping area. Its right next to a post office drop box.

We've got them here in CO, as well. And really, securing/monitoring them shouldn't be a significant burden. My closest one, for example, is in the middle of a parking lot at the DMV. There's a camera pointed at it, stores in every direction from it, and frankly it's a pretty sturdy thing (think small dumpster with just a small slot for dropping ballots).

No one's tampering with that thing and not being noticed.

You know how Trump is always complaining about showers and toilet water flow...

Scraper wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 4:37 pm

Blackhawk wrote: ↑Wed Aug 12, 2020 4:34 pm And to be honest, I've never actually seen a ballot drop box. Ever. I can't even find references to Indiana having them.

Ohio didn't have them either, until this year. I think it's a relatively new thing for our neck of the woods.

Here, too. Town Hall has drop boxes for tax payments, water/sewer, electric, and US mail. They added a snazzy-looking new one for ballots. The tax and ballot drops both go to the Town Clerk, so they could have just shared that one, but I reckon keeping them separate is a security thing...or maybe volume, IDK.

CNBC

President Donald Trump issued an executive order Friday that will force China’s ByteDance to sell or spin off its U.S. TikTok business within 90 days.
...
The order was seen as good news for TikTok — a wildly popular short form video-sharing app — and its future in the U.S., at least relative to an earlier one from Trump last week. The prior executive order could have forced U.S. based app stores to stop distributing the TikTok app if ByteDance did not reach a deal to divest from it in 45 days.

Can't really argue.

What sort of man would go golfing as his own brother lay dying?

Apparently his best friend too, not that Trump knows what those are.

Mr. President, Jill and I are sad to learn of your younger brother Robert’s passing. I know the tremendous pain of losing a loved one — and I know how important family is in moments like these. I hope you know that our prayers are with you all.

Skinypupy wrote:

Mr. President, Jill and I are sad to learn of your younger brother Robert’s passing. I know the tremendous pain of losing a loved one — and I know how important family is in moments like these. I hope you know that our prayers are with you all.

That's really kind and compassionate of Biden to post...for someone who hates God.

It is sort of amazing that Biden just showed more empathy, compassion, and humanity in three sentences than Trump has demonstrated in 3+ years.

Sympathies to our President and his family.

What, no #WrongTrump? Your team will cancel culture you if you keep this up.

I would express sympathy if I thought trump was capable of empathy. I wonder if he can even experience grief.

He's very adept at experiencing grievance. Is that close enough?

em2nought wrote: ↑Sun Aug 16, 2020 2:26 pm Sympathies to our President and his family.

What, no #WrongTrump? Your team will cancel culture you if you keep this up.

You’re just fine doing both sides of the conversation at this point. Why not just go off on your own and do that? I can’t imagine waiting for us to fulfill your fantasy of what you think we will say can be that great for you.

hepcat wrote: ↑Sun Aug 16, 2020 7:44 pm You’re just fine doing both sides of the conversation at this point. Why not just go off on your own and do that? I can’t imagine waiting for us to fulfill your fantasy of what you think we will say can be that great for you.

your reply was all he wanted...