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stessier
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Re: Running

Post by stessier »

I am in pain.

Today was Run #136 for the year. It was cool (~68F) and less humid than it has been in weeks after a front rolled through yesterday. I've used the exact same outfit for all 136 runs. Since I missed yesterday because of the rain, I decided to push it today on my planned 6.1 mile route. Everything was going well until around mile 4.5 I noticed some chaffing in the lower buttock area due to the elastic in my shorts. Adjustments really didn't make a difference, so I just resigned myself and kept going. Around mile 5, I also noticed chaffing on my right lat which also just continued to get worse.

My shower afterward let me know just how raw things had gotten - it was like I was showering in glass shards. To add insult to injury, I had to put on jeans for work and now I can't figure out if it is less painful to sit or stand given that neither actually feels good. I don't know why my clothing chose today to betray me, but I am not amused.
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EvilHomer3k
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Re: Running

Post by EvilHomer3k »

Chafing always sucks. I have a pair of running shorts that I can't wear for anything over 3 miles unless it's cooler out.
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Baroquen
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Re: Running

Post by Baroquen »

Ugh - chafing. While it's probably common knowledge, I only recently found that Body Glide helps for me, even after the fact. Your mileage may vary.
JCC
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Re: Running

Post by JCC »

Body Glide is the best. I am VERY chafe prone and the Glide keeps me from ever getting chafed from walking or running.
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Baroquen
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Re: Running

Post by Baroquen »

Oops.. I just reread my post. I figure most of us knew about Body Glide. It was my using it to help after the chafing that was new to me. :doh:
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disarm
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Re: Running

Post by disarm »

There are few things that I've experienced in my life more painful than getting in the shower and finding our that my nipples were raw after a long run

I quickly learned that any run over 3-4 miles puts me at risk for nipple chafing, especially if I'm sweating a lot. My solution is small pieces of tape, specifically 3M Transpore medical tape that I can get from work...easy to tear small pieces, sticks even when wet, and not too painful to remove at the end.

Body Glide is also very useful for other places. I've never had trouble with chafing inside my shorts, but a little Body Glide between my toes keeps them from rubbing and getting blisters as I get close to half-marathon distance.
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stessier
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Re: Running

Post by stessier »

I use Body Glide on every run...just not in the places that got effected this time. Really no idea what happened. It's healing slowly.
disarm wrote: Thu Aug 05, 2021 3:20 pm I quickly learned that any run over 3-4 miles puts me at risk for nipple chafing, especially if I'm sweating a lot. My solution is small pieces of tape, specifically 3M Transpore medical tape that I can get from work...easy to tear small pieces, sticks even when wet, and not too painful to remove at the end.
I used to use that, but found it too aggressive. Changed to Nexcare Absolute Waterproof First Aid tape (also from 3M). Works great.
I require a reminder as to why raining arcane destruction is not an appropriate response to all of life's indignities. - Vaarsuvius
Global Steam Wishmaslist Tracking
Running____2014: 1300.55 miles____2015: 2036.13 miles____2016: 1012.75 miles____2017: 1105.82 miles____2018: 1318.91 miles__2019: 2000.00 miles
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Baroquen
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Re: Running

Post by Baroquen »

+1 for the medical tape. I tried other items over the years, but the tape has worked best.

Blisters on the toes are new to me. Not a problem during training, but it has flared up during the last marathon or two. I need to remember to use the glide before the next one.
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Re: Running

Post by Jeff V »

Using technical running shirts usually doesn't nipple chafe me like cotton t-shirts do. While running is ostensibly something one ought to be able to do with no cash lay-out, when you're serious about it, there's advantage beyond style for the expensive clothing (and shoes) available.

I've even had luck running in biking shorts which wick away moisture in your neither regions and cling tightly so no chafing from loose clothing. And if you happen to jog by Hepcat's house when he's out on his front porch sipping mimosas, you might just get to see him hysterically try to gouge his eyes out without spilling his drink.
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Re: Running

Post by Jeff V »

Baroquen wrote: Fri Aug 06, 2021 10:05 pm Blisters on the toes are new to me.
My problem now isn't blisters, but painful calluses that develop at the tips of my toes and the backs of my heels. Aquaphor helps but takes a few days of multiple applications to soften things up so it's not too painful to run. Or walk, for that matter.
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Skinypupy
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Re: Running

Post by Skinypupy »

Skinypupy wrote: Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:20 am - Longer term #3 (6 months) goal is to run a full 2 mile route at at least a 10:00 min/mi pace. Hopefully that's not too unrealistic.
This was my original post back on March 4, with my 6 month mark coming up on Aug 24.

Here is this morning's run, my first time under 10:00/mile:

Image

:dance: :dance:

Time to reset the goals, I suppose.
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YellowKing
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Re: Running

Post by YellowKing »

I went for my first run in over a month yesterday, this time in the new neighborhood. Let's just say I REALLY miss the old neighborhood, which was connected to several others and provided decent out and backs of around 3 miles (or longer, if you planned it right). The new neighborhood is significantly smaller and self-contained, so an out and back from my house to the main road and back is only a mile. If I run every cul-de-sac along the way I can somewhat eke out 1.5. Feels like I'm in a bit of a fishbowl.

There are some quiet roads behind us but they go through some pretty sketchy areas, so I'm not inclined to run there, and my only other option is an extremely busy road out front.

At any rate, my first run back didn't go great. It was extremely hot and humid, and by the time I got through 1.5m I felt like I was approaching heat exhaustion and just had to get back home.

On the bright side, the neighborhood IS a great place to run if you don't mind doing a couple of laps. Almost no traffic, very quiet, and we have a pond in the backyard that makes for a fantastic cool-down spot to get in some push-ups or other exercises in solitude.
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Re: Running

Post by JCC »

YK, I think we live in the same region. It's been brutal this week. I am not running (not going to poke that bear until it's cooler) but this week I am walking more than a minute/mile slower than I did last week. It was 10 degrees cooler and less humid a week ago. Just brutal this week.
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Re: Running

Post by Skinypupy »

We haven't had the heat, but instead have had all the smoke from the CA/OR fires settle on us over the past week. Over last weekend, Salt Lake had the worst air quality in the entire world. It was like trying to run through a campfire. My lungs were killing me when I was done.

It's mostly cleared out, but that was a brutal few days.
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Re: Running

Post by Jeff V »

Isn't shitty air quality a thing in Salt Lake City? I was banished there for an eternity one week, and the smog was so thick you couldn't see the Wasatch Mountains from any further than a quarter mile away. I drove out to the salt flats one day, looked back toward the city, and there was a thick layer of smog smothering it. Then one day I went to Park City, above the smog layer and it was spectacular.

We've had haze from fires here in Chicago for about a month or so. This week has been shitty hot and humid, with daily severe storms. This morning, my wife had to pull into a parking lot on her way home from work because she was afraid the wind was going to flip our SUV.

Running is rather out of the question. I walked the dog the other day, she came home with symptoms of heat stroke, she couldn't stand and my wife had to feed her ice cubes until she gathered her wits. I'm not sure she is normal yet (then again, she is very old and could be suffering from doggie dementia).

Fortunately the weather should take a turn toward the awesome on Friday.
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Re: Running

Post by Isgrimnur »

It's almost as if people are the problem.
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Re: Running

Post by Jeff V »

Good it jives with my memories. They suffer from the same problem Los Angeles does, mountains keeping the smog in.
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Re: Running

Post by Skinypupy »

Jeff V wrote: Wed Aug 11, 2021 8:26 pm Isn't shitty air quality a thing in Salt Lake City? I was banished there for an eternity one week, and the smog was so thick you couldn't see the Wasatch Mountains from any further than a quarter mile away. I drove out to the salt flats one day, looked back toward the city, and there was a thick layer of smog smothering it. Then one day I went to Park City, above the smog layer and it was spectacular.
In the winters, yes. The smog that the cold aid traps in the valley is horrid, and we’re usually right up there with the worst in the US. Never happens in the summer though.

In my 28 years living here, I’ve never seen air quality as bad in the summer as we had last week.
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Re: Running

Post by Jeff V »

Skinypupy wrote: Wed Aug 11, 2021 8:56 pm
Jeff V wrote: Wed Aug 11, 2021 8:26 pm Isn't shitty air quality a thing in Salt Lake City? I was banished there for an eternity one week, and the smog was so thick you couldn't see the Wasatch Mountains from any further than a quarter mile away. I drove out to the salt flats one day, looked back toward the city, and there was a thick layer of smog smothering it. Then one day I went to Park City, above the smog layer and it was spectacular.
In the winters, yes. The smog that the cold aid traps in the valley is horrid, and we’re usually right up there with the worst in the US. Never happens in the summer though.

In my 28 years living here, I’ve never seen air quality as bad in the summer as we had last week.
Ah, okay, I was there a week before the 2002 Winter Olympics.
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Re: Running

Post by Kurth »

Tomorrow morning is the beginning of Hood to Coast 2021. I’m in van 1 with a 7:15 start time. Kind of surprised they haven’t cancelled the race this year again with the COVID situation being what it is in OR, but my team is all vaccinated, and we’re not planning on hanging out at the exchanges for any longer than necessary to pick up our runner and get our next one out and off. Will be interesting to see how crowded it is this year - I’m predicting a noticeable drop in participation, which should make things go a lot smoother than most years. We’ll see. . .
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Re: Running

Post by EvilHomer3k »

Jeff V wrote: Wed Aug 11, 2021 8:26 pm Fortunately the weather should take a turn toward the awesome on Friday.
It's still awful outside. You said the weather was going to get better two weeks ago. Punxsutawney Phil you are not. This morning at 5:30 it was already 74 and 91% humidity. The dew point was 71. Can't wait for it bot be 40 for three days before it drops to 3 below zero for 2 months (though I don't mind the cold at all). Still got 4 miles in this morning. Hopefully it will be better Sunday. We are doing 10 Sunday to get ready for our 15k trail race in two weeks.

Good luck, Kurth. I hope it's a fun race even if you can't stay for anything after. I'm not big on doing that but there's a lot more reason not to lately.
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Re: Running

Post by Kurth »

HtC 2021 is in the books. Definitely fewer teams on the course, but still pretty crowded at the exchanges. All in all, it went pretty smoothly, and I was lucky to be on the fastest team I’ve run with to date, so we ended early Saturday morning. Finished our last leg (for van 1) at 6:35 AM and decided we weren’t interested in hanging around at the beach through the early morning waiting for van 2 to finish, so we booked it home and were showered and home by 8:30 AM.

Kind of a weird HtC experience, but it was nice to get back to early, and we just had no interest in our van for hanging around on a cold beach wearing masks, so we didn’t mind skipping the party.

Hoping things return to normal next year, though!
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Re: Running

Post by Jeff V »

EvilHomer3k wrote: Fri Aug 27, 2021 3:17 pm Punxsutawney Phil you are not.
Hey now, no need to start calling me a ground pig. The preferred term is "Nostradumbass".

FTR, the meteorologist who provided that forecast retired on Friday.
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Re: Running

Post by Skinypupy »

Two questions this morning:

#1: For those who have been running for a while, I'm curious what your ratio of "performance" runs (i.e. really pushing yourself, working to set new personal bests, increasing distance, etc.) vs. "maintenance" runs (i.e. running for exercise but not overly concerned about times/distance) is. Having only started 6 months ago, most of my runs have been in the "performance" category, where I'm always pushing myself to get better. However, I'm starting to realize that's probably not sustainable in the long term, and have been throttling it back somewhat a couple times a week.

It is nice to find that as I get in better shape, my "maintenance" runs start to become better than my previous "performance" runs. For example, this morning's run felt really slow to me, but it was actually my 12th best time overall, and was significantly better than my "oh my god, I'm going to die" run even a month ago. :) Just curious how others approach that mix.

#2 (with apologies if I asked this already): As we start approaching the winter months, I'm curious if anyone has cold-weather running gear recommendations (other than getting a treadmill...I hate those). I really want to keep running outside, but will obviously need something more than shorts and t-shirts when mornings get down into the 20's during the winter. Mostly curious about good winter running shoes, as internet opinions seem to vary wildly on recommended brands and styles.
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disarm
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Re: Running

Post by disarm »


Skinypupy wrote:#2 (with apologies if I asked this already): As we start approaching the winter months, I'm curious if anyone has cold-weather running gear recommendations (other than getting a treadmill...I hate those). I really want to keep running outside, but will obviously need something more than shorts and t-shirts when mornings get down into the 20's during the winter. Mostly curious about good winter running shoes, as internet opinions seem to vary wildly on recommended brands and styles.
Running in cold weather isn't nearly as bad as you might be thinking. I'll run in shorts and a t-shirt down to 45-50 and be very comfortable after an initial few minutes to warm up. I use either non-insulated running pants or tights above 30 degrees. Once it drops below 30, I usually do polyester moisture-wicking baselayer/long underwear under my running pants. It takes surprisingly little to keep your legs comfortably warm as long as you can block wind.

On top, layers of moisture wicking, breathable material and something to block wind are key. I've often used a long-sleeve polyester 'technical' shirt under a thin Merino wool fleece and been very comfortable. In a lot of cases, I start out a little cold, but quickly warm up enough that I'm unzipping my fleece to cool off. If it's really windy, I put a non-insulated windbreaker over the fleece. I cover my ears with a lightweight thermal headband and sometimes wear a fleece beanie cap.

I've run in single-digit temps a few times and never had an issue with cold feet in my usual running shoes as long as I put slightly heavier wool socks underneath. I know some people have "winter shoes" or wind gaiters, but I've never found them necessary as long as my feet stay dry. Staying dry really becomes the key; start sweating inside too many warm layers, and you can actually end up feeling colder due to the moisture. It really pays off to invest in quick-drying, moisture wicking winter gear if you'll be outside a lot. Wool is a great option for warm and lightweight.

Lastly, keeping my hands from freezing is often the biggest challenge. I know people who wear giant insulated mittens with their skin-tight running gear to save their fingers. My preference is a pair of running gloves with "wind hoods" that tuck into the back of the glove but can be pulled over your fingers when it's cold, pretty much turning your gloves into mittens with a wind-resistant finger cover. They're a great balance between warmth and ability to still use your fingers without fully removing your mittens.

My personal coldest run was while helping to coach a C25k group during the winter. The program ended with a St Patrick's 5k race, and we always ran the course a couple weeks before actual race day. It was the last weekend of February in CT and a brisk 9 degrees when we started. My assignment was to stay with the tail end of the group, which put me alongside a morbidly obese woman who finished her first ever 5k distance in 57 freezing cold, windy minutes..but she never gave up. I covered an extra mile running back and forth ahead of her to exert myself enough to stay warm while she made it to the finish that day, and she did it again two weeks later when it was only slightly warmer (mid-20s). She said she never felt the cold because all she could think about was meeting her goal.


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Kurth
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Re: Running

Post by Kurth »

Skinypupy wrote: Tue Aug 31, 2021 1:48 pm Two questions this morning:

#1: For those who have been running for a while, I'm curious what your ratio of "performance" runs (i.e. really pushing yourself, working to set new personal bests, increasing distance, etc.) vs. "maintenance" runs (i.e. running for exercise but not overly concerned about times/distance) is. Having only started 6 months ago, most of my runs have been in the "performance" category, where I'm always pushing myself to get better. However, I'm starting to realize that's probably not sustainable in the long term, and have been throttling it back somewhat a couple times a week.

It is nice to find that as I get in better shape, my "maintenance" runs start to become better than my previous "performance" runs. For example, this morning's run felt really slow to me, but it was actually my 12th best time overall, and was significantly better than my "oh my god, I'm going to die" run even a month ago. :) Just curious how others approach that mix.

#2 (with apologies if I asked this already): As we start approaching the winter months, I'm curious if anyone has cold-weather running gear recommendations (other than getting a treadmill...I hate those). I really want to keep running outside, but will obviously need something more than shorts and t-shirts when mornings get down into the 20's during the winter. Mostly curious about good winter running shoes, as internet opinions seem to vary wildly on recommended brands and styles.
Two answers, for what they're worth!

(1) Good guidance is to run 80% of your runs at an easy, comfortable pace. When I first heard that, I was skeptical and really had a hard time following that guidance. I still don't hit the 80% number, but I've come a long way from where I was a year or two ago, when I was probably doing the inverse and running 80% of my runs at a challenging pace. Now I'm probably more in the 40% challenging/60% easy ratio. For me, it's a real challenge to dial it back. I have a limited time to run and - for me - an ambitious mileage goal this year (2,021 miles in 2021), so I'm almost always trying to cram as many miles in as possible. But I've found that backing off the pace significantly more has had two big advantages - First, I feel better. Definitely less wear and tear and more recovery going on. And, second, I'm in a much better position to get more out of my challenging runs than I was before. I finished the Hood to Coast relay this past weekend, and my results were really good for me. I ran the hardest legs, and my times were much better than in years past when I was running easier legs.

(2) I hate running in the cold, but when I do, the clothing I find to be the most valuable includes good gloves, a hat, tights and a high-quality vest. The vests can be expensive, but I swear by the Nike Aeroloft products.
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Re: Running

Post by EvilHomer3k »

Honestly, I pretty much never do performance runs. I just run. I probably should but I don't. Most of my 'performance' runs are just going further than the last time or doing hills. I may do a performance mile but otherwise it's usually just at races that I push myself.

I generally enjoy running in winter. I'm very warm blooded and sweat a lot. I have run in temps up to fifteen below zero. Everyone has different thresholds so you'll need to find yours. For me, it's not cold until it's below freezing.


Here is what I have for winter:
thin short sleeve wool shirt
thin long sleeve wool shirt
thicker (base layer) wool shirt - something like the smartwool base layer - bonus if it has thumb holes the most important piece of clothing I own for winter running.
Winter running jacket - mine is an Adidas which I love. The back is very ventilated and the front is not, an under armour heat gear sweatshirt also works for me but I tend to overheat in them
lightweight running tights - Others would probably want something a bit heavier
gym shorts - just the basic shorts I run with in the summer
running gloves
ski gloves (oversized)
Feetures Socks extra cushioned
well cushioned wool socks (smartwool, darn tough) - mine aren't running specific socks
wool headband - you could do a wool stocking hat but I always overheat with them even when it's below 0
Trail running shoes if it's icy or running in snow

I'll mix and match these depending on the temp. When it gets really cold I'll wear the winter sweatshirt/adidas winter shirt, the base layer wool shirt, the thin short sleeve wool shirt, tights, running shorts, wool socks, running gloves, ski gloves, and the wool headband. That's pretty much as far as I've had to go. If you walk out of the house and you aren't cold you are overdressed.
That sound of the spoon scraping over the can ribbing as you corral the last ravioli or two is the signal that a great treat is coming. It's the washboard solo in God's own
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Re: Running

Post by raydude »

I haven't consciously been pushing myself or doing performance runs. I have been noticing that my endurance is getting better though, even if my pace isn't improving. I've mostly been focused on goals over time - like hitting 100k per month. I do track my pace with an app and I'm happy if I see a slow upward trend. Heck, a year ago I wouldn't have believed I could do 100k/month.

For winter I have a moisture-wicking long sleeve shirt, cold weather running pants, and a Smartwool beanie. I also have a winter running jacket and gloves for when it's really cold out. I use the "add 10-15 deg to outside temp" rule of thumb. So if it's 40deg out I'll dress as if it's 50 deg and go with the long sleeve shirt and shorts.
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Re: Running

Post by Skinypupy »

Thanks all, I'm gonna start looking online for winter gear this week and this gives me a good place to start. I expect that I'll enjoy winter running more than summer, as I'm generally much more of a cold weather person.
EvilHomer3k wrote: Tue Aug 31, 2021 4:23 pm Trail running shoes if it's icy or running in snow
Any particular brand you prefer?

I absolutely love my Saucony running shoes, but I think they're going to be way too lightweight for winter. Even the slightest bit of moisture soaks through directly to my socks. I do have some sturdier walking shoes (Sketchers), but have found them to be really heavy and clunky when running. Need to find a balance between the two.
EvilHomer3k wrote: Tue Aug 31, 2021 4:23 pm Honestly, I pretty much never do performance runs. I just run. I probably should but I don't. Most of my 'performance' runs are just going further than the last time or doing hills. I may do a performance mile but otherwise it's usually just at races that I push myself.
I'm a little worried that if I remove the performance aspect, my interest will wane. I'm a bit of a metrics person by nature, and being able to see numbers go up (or down) has been very motivating for me. I've known all along that I'll hit a plateau at some point where I'm not seeing significant improvement on a weekly basis, and I think I'm starting to see some of that. Last week was the first week since I started where my per mile time was worse than the previous week. That caused me to push it probably a little harder than I should have, and my legs were really paying for it on Sunday.

Just need to find that balance between incremental improvement and finding satisfaction in running just because the exercise is good for me. I'm also not doing nearly the distances you all are (nor do I have any desire to), so that balance will likely be easier to find. My loop is either 2.5 or 3.1 miles, depending on how I'm feeling that morning.

Oh, and hills can fuck right off. They're the bane of my running existence. :lol:
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Re: Running

Post by Skinypupy »

A nonny mouse wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 11:36 am 1. set your running gear out the night before so you can grab it and go. This would include anything else you would take with you (phone, headphones, water, etc.) I just have a house key and the shorts/shirt.
When Nonny mentioned this a few months ago, I thought it was really strange advice. I mean, why would getting things out the night before matter? It has now become my most important nightly ritual.

I set out absolutely everything I need the night before. Earbuds and stick of gum on the kitchen counter. Running shorts/shirt/socks on the bathroom counter. Yoga strap, baseball hat, shoes, and post-run sweat towel on the couch (so I don't have to wake up Mrs. Skinypupy digging around for them in the bedroom when I get back). Music I want queued up in my playlist. I have very much become a creature of habit, and that habit absolutely helps me get up and out the door in the mornings.

So, thanks for that advice Nonny, even if I blew it off at the time. :)
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Re: Running

Post by EvilHomer3k »

Skinypupy wrote: Tue Aug 31, 2021 5:27 pm
A nonny mouse wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 11:36 am 1. set your running gear out the night before so you can grab it and go. This would include anything else you would take with you (phone, headphones, water, etc.) I just have a house key and the shorts/shirt.
When Nonny mentioned this a few months ago, I thought it was really strange advice. I mean, why would getting things out the night before matter? It has now become my most important nightly ritual.

I set out absolutely everything I need the night before. Earbuds and stick of gum on the kitchen counter. Running shorts/shirt/socks on the bathroom counter. Yoga strap, baseball hat, shoes, and post-run sweat towel on the couch (so I don't have to wake up Mrs. Skinypupy digging around for them in the bedroom when I get back). Music I want queued up in my playlist. I have very much become a creature of habit, and that habit absolutely helps me get up and out the door in the mornings.

So, thanks for that advice Nonny, even if I blew it off at the time. :)
I do the same. Things always go smoother when I do and I'm more motivated to go because my stuff's already ready, might as well go.

If numbers and improvement work for you I don't see any reason you should change drastically (if at all).

I was incorrect about the winter running outer shirt I have. It's the Asics Thermopolis Fleece Crew. I love it almost as much as my merino wool shirt.

Pretty much all my shoes are New Balance because of the wider toe box but still narrow heel. My current shoes are the 1080v10s which I got on clearance at Joe's New Balance Outlet and the New Balance Fresh Foam More (also at the outlet). I am looking to replace my current trail shoes which are the New Balance Fresh Foam Roav Trail with something a bit more cushioned. I'll probably end up with the NB Fresh Foam More Trail but I"m balking at the $165 price tag. I tried Hoka Clifton's but felt the heel was way too wide for me. They never felt right. I'd look at your current shoes and if you like them, find a trail shoe from the same company. Either that or go to a running specific store. They tend to have the best selection of running shoes in my area. I'd also look at Hoka One One as their return policy is fantastic (you can return them even if you've run in them).
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Re: Running

Post by A nonny mouse »

Skinypupy wrote: Tue Aug 31, 2021 5:27 pm
A nonny mouse wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 11:36 am 1. set your running gear out the night before so you can grab it and go. This would include anything else you would take with you (phone, headphones, water, etc.) I just have a house key and the shorts/shirt.
When Nonny mentioned this a few months ago, I thought it was really strange advice. I mean, why would getting things out the night before matter? It has now become my most important nightly ritual.

I set out absolutely everything I need the night before. Earbuds and stick of gum on the kitchen counter. Running shorts/shirt/socks on the bathroom counter. Yoga strap, baseball hat, shoes, and post-run sweat towel on the couch (so I don't have to wake up Mrs. Skinypupy digging around for them in the bedroom when I get back). Music I want queued up in my playlist. I have very much become a creature of habit, and that habit absolutely helps me get up and out the door in the mornings.

So, thanks for that advice Nonny, even if I blew it off at the time. :)
Not a problem. You finally came around :)
I look at it like getting my lunch ready the night before. I have the time in the evening, much more so than if I am late in the morning.

Anyway, winter stuff, I am minimalist. I usually dress warmer than one is "supposed" to, but I would rather sweat than be cold on a run.

I also am a notorious cheap-ass, so I don't go for "runner's" gear branded by running companies ($60-$80 for tights? Bitch, please. Not a chance). Yes I do have some New Balance shorts, but they are ones I have received as gifts for birthdays (my wife is great at finding sales!). Tights are from Target - not for any reason other than they are like $19, suit my purpose, and I found them there. They used to be Champion, then their new brand All in motion. They aren't thick, or insulated and that is fine. Once you are moving you don't need that much insulation. I can't stand the capri length or 3/4 length. Full length or nothing.

The coldest it gets around here is about 18 deg F, so not quite Evil Homers neck of the woods. LOL. The level of dress is mood dependent - if it is mid 40-ish I will wear shorts and long sleeved running shirt. Below that temp I wear tights, shorts over them, long sleeved shirt , normal running socks and shoes, and if needed extra protection a cycling windbreaker (I have a Bellweather from 2000 that is still going strong). I just bought a Baleaf cycling windbreaker and It is o.k. The collar is long and rubs my neck so I have to tuck it inside when running - (the model in that pic has a really long neck). For 30 F and below I also put on a cheap knitted beanie cap (wal mart, $3) and some cheap gloves (3 pair for $5? I don't remember).

Like summer running, I set everything out the night before, and don't carry any extra things besides a house key.
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Re: Running

Post by Blackhawk »

So... tap tap... this thing on?

I am not planning on running, but I'm considering planning on running. A few years ago I tried running. I made it about three days before my knees made it very clear that they weren't up to me running. Since then I've lost close to 50 pounds, plus I've been doing regular light leg and core strength training four+ times a week for nine months (squats and/or lunges, plus planks and bridges), and I've been doing regular stretches (hamstrings, Achilles, quads, hips, other hips, etc) several times a week almost as long. My legs actually have some amount of muscle, flexibility, and stability. The other day I was out for a walk and experimented by jogging a block. A year ago I was panting hurrying across the street. This time I wasn't even breathing hard (I've been doing a lot of cardio all year, too.) So I think running may be a possibility worth checking out.

I was thinking about trying the fabled 'couch to 5k' (although there seem to be a number of versions.) I haven't run since the last time a gym coach made me run around the track (and even then I probably walked), and two of my own three kids have already graduated high school if that puts some context on it. I hoped to ask a few questions.

1. I'm still fairly overweight - about 60 pounds over my ideal. Am I likely to destroy my joints doing this? Yeah, I know the correct advice is 'talk to your doctor', but that's the correct advice for every question under the sun. My doctor would drop me if I called for an appointment as often as I run into that advice.

2. Shoes. This seems to be impossible to ask about online. Every single time I see the question asked, the discussion is swarmed by people who insist that if you aren't spending $200 on shoes and replacing them every three month you'd might as well not even try. I'm guessing this is just the typical rich elitist bullshit, but what's the real answer?

3. Weather. Not everyone lives in southern California. Some of us live in places with heat advisories in the summer, thunderstorms all spring, and then sub-freezing temperatures all winter, often with meaningful amounts of snow. How do you actually stay in shape with running if you live in a place that isn't conducive to running half the time?

4. Which couch to 5k is the real one?
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Re: Running

Post by disarm »


Blackhawk wrote:So... tap tap... this thing on?

I am not planning on running, but I'm considering planning on running...

I was thinking about trying the fabled 'couch to 5k' (although there seem to be a number of versions.)...

1. I'm still fairly overweight - about 60 pounds over my ideal. Am I likely to destroy my joints doing this?

2. Shoes. This seems to be impossible to ask about online. Every single time I see the question asked, the discussion is swarmed by people who insist that if you aren't spending $200 on shoes and replacing them every three month you'd might as well not even try. I'm guessing this is just the typical rich elitist bullshit, but what's the real answer?

3. Weather. Not everyone lives in southern California. Some of us live in places with heat advisories in the summer, thunderstorms all spring, and then sub-freezing temperatures all winter, often with meaningful amounts of snow. How do you actually stay in shape with running if you live in a place that isn't conducive to running half the time?

4. Which couch to 5k is the real one?
If you're motivated, you can make it happen...but I do think that running is incredibly daunting and fairly difficult at the start.

1 - You won't destroy your joints, but it's probably not going to feel good at first. I had aches and pains at the start that went away as I got my body used to the activity and developed better form. It takes some time, but you'll develop the muscles you need to continue running comfortably. I had horrible shin splints when I started, but stretching and strengthening got me over the hump. Contrary to popular belief, running doesn't ruin your knees. If you're older and already have arthritis, however, it could be uncomfortable.

2 - Good shoes are important, but you don't have to spend a fortune. I've been wearing the same style of running shoes for years (Brooks Ravenna) and they go for about $100 if you get the latest version (revised annually and different color options). The trick is buying the previous year's version when the new ones are released. I typically get mine for $70-80 on clearance. As for replacing them, the general recommendation is every 500 miles for a typical shoe; you'll be able to tell when the cushion is wearing out.

3 - The thing about running is that you can do it almost anywhere, almost any time. You just need the willpower to get outside and run in less than perfect weather. Personally, I think hot weather is the most challenging. You can add layers for cold, rain is annoying but won't hurt you, but you can only do so much about heat. You will find that you adapt some to hot weather through the season though.

4 - Any C25k that encourages you to build slowly is fine. Most start with run/walk intervals over short distance, then alternate increases in either distance or running interval duration each week. The key is slow but steady progression; push to much too soon and you're likely to hurt yourself and give up.

If you're motivated to give it a try, just take it slow and don't give up too quickly. The first few weeks are going to be unpleasant as you get your body used to a new activity, but it's just a hump to get over on the way to getting better.

Last edited by disarm on Tue Sep 07, 2021 8:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Running

Post by stessier »

Building off of what Disarm said -

I think it is daunting at first because you don't know what to expect, you don't have a routine, and it can take a while to see progress. But I think a lot of that can be overcome with good coaching/planning so you have realistic goals.

1 - there were studies done on high mileage runners and they found no greater incidence of joint degradation compared to their lower mileage counterparts. What they couldn't answer was if people who were less prone to joint injuries were more likely to become high mileage runners. But at least it didn't show there was a direct correlation.

2 - Shoes really do matter! It is useful if you know your gait - do you underpronate, overpronate, or have a neutral gait? There are different shoes for each type and they can really make the experience more comfortable. Keep in mind that 500 miles is a rough estimate and the heavier you are, the faster shoes can wear out.

3 - I totally agree, hot weather is the worst. The reason I switched to running before the sun was up is because I moved to SC and running after work was like a death sentence. It's still miserable before the sun comes up, but a survivable miserable. :)

Good luck!
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Re: Running

Post by Blackhawk »

Thanks. I will digest the information.

My concern with the joints was more about my extra weight pounding down on them than long-term effects (as I've lost almost 50 pounds this year, and if I can keep it up I'll be near my ideal weight by next summer.) My last few experiences with high-impact activities have made me a little cautious - my brief attempt at running and my brief use of jumping jacks both left me with knee problems for weeks afterwards. I am considerably lighter with significantly more muscle in my legs than then, though.

Indiana is comparable to SC in the summer - we're about five degrees cooler, but average 10% higher humidity. The humidity is high enough that it doesn't really cool off much at night (or before dawn.) There are months when strenuous outdoor activity is challenging, to say the least.

I was thinking about giving it a go as fall is coming up, but I've got a couple of upcoming cost commitments. I will look around and see if I can find something cheap (I'm seeing... ok reviews of Saucony shoes, which run about $60.) I would be running mostly on asphalt, with occasional detours up onto the sidewalk to avoid traffic (I'd be sticking to side streets where traffic is rare.)

I did read that you should go a little larger in running shoes than in normal wear shoes, so I'd probably be looking at a 12 1/2 to 13 wide.
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Re: Running

Post by Skinypupy »

As someone who fairly recently started running (this past March), here's my $.02.

1. I also started fairly overweight. I'm still in that category, but about 25 lbs less so than when I started. Just know that the first few weeks are going to suck. Big time. You'll be sore everywhere, even in places you don't expect (worst for me was my shoulders until I started adjusting my running form). I have no idea about the long-term effect on joints, but I have noticed that I've become significantly stronger as I've continued, and the majority of those aches and pains have gone away. My knees still get a little bit sore, but I destroyed those from 35 years of soccer long before I ever started running.

2. I noticed a huge difference when I bought a pair of actual running shoes. I would say that's probably my #1 recommendation for getting started. You don't have to go nuts and buy the most expensive pair out there, but having shoes that are actually designed for running make a big difference. I have a pair of Saucony Ride 13 shoes that I've been using for 6 months and they're still in great shape nearing 300 miles. You can get them for around $70 right now.

3. I've only done spring and summer running, and am already working on gearing up for winter. Ask me again next spring and I'll let you know how that goes. :lol: I did have to switch from afternoon to morning runs when it got hot, but have found that I actually enjoy that quite a bit more. It's a good way to start the day, once you can get over the (rather large) mental block of running first thing. See my comment upthread about setting all your stuff out the night before...that small habit really does make a big difference.

4. I didn't do any sort of formal C25K running program, but used the same basic principles when I started. Start with combined running/walking, increasing the frequency and distance of your running as you get in better shape. For me, it helped to set some initial goals to work towards as well (i.e. run 2 miles, run under 11:00/mile, run 2.5 miles, etc.), and you can continually recalibrate those as you progress. I also found that having some sort of running tracker program has been a big motivator as well. I use Runkeeper (I subbed for the Pro version at $40/year) and having the tracking info, split data, best times list, etc. has really kept me on track and continually working to get better.

As others have said, the hardest part is getting started and not getting discouraged. It sounds simple and silly, but just getting out the door to go is 90% of the battle. Start slow, recognize that improvement will be incremental, set a few goals to go after, and you'll likely be surprised at the rapid progress you'll make. I've noticed a big difference in my overall energy level, and working towards some milestones has been remarkably satisfying.

You've also got a really good group of folks here that can provide great info and support. It has been a huge help for me.
Blackhawk wrote: Tue Sep 07, 2021 11:14 am I did read that you should go a little larger in running shoes than in normal wear shoes, so I'd probably be looking at a 12 1/2 to 13 wide.
This does seem to be the case. I typically wear 10.5, but my running shoes are 11.5.
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Re: Running

Post by YellowKing »

As far as the Couch to 5K thing goes, I really recommend the "My First 5K" guided program on Runkeeper Pro. If you're not ready to spend the $40 on Runkeeper it may not be an option for you, but having tried multiple couch to 5K programs over the years, it's above and beyond my favorite.

Coach Erin who guides you through the workouts is very motivational, goes into proper running posture (which is huge when you're first starting out), and running mentality (also huge). Most other Couch-to-5Ks are basically a laundry list you do on your own (do this, then this, then this), so I really appreciated having the extra content. It's a 6-week, 3 times a week course, and I've been through it twice and never failed a workout (as I have with many other Couch-to-5K programs).

Speaking of Runkeeper, it's also my #1 running app and well worth the money to upgrade. They have a lot of other guided running workouts that they've added recently. I'm looking forward to trying some of those out. I'm actually going through the My First 5K again so I can roll it right into the My First 10K guided workout.

Also agree with the comments on the running shoes. If you don't spend any other money on running, get yourself a decent pair of running shoes. If you don't, you're begging for injury, getting discouraged, or both.
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Re: Running

Post by EvilHomer3k »

1. I honestly wouldn't worry too much about this. I have arthritis in my knees. I had a torn acl and mcl. I played football, wrestled, and did martial arts. About 5 years ago I was told I only had 30% of my cartilage left in my knees and high impact things were a bad idea (by they surgeon who repaired my ACL). I stopped running for the most part for years. Last September I started again. My knees feel better today than they did the previous several years. I run 4 times a week with one of those times being at least 6 miles (last week it was 10). I used to take tylenol before every run and now I only take it for long runs. My knees feel better today than they did a year ago. I was 263 last September when I started and now I'm 235 (though I'd be less if I didn't drink so much beer). Everyone is different but in my case I feel that running has helped my knees.

2. Absolutely, shoes matter. But as disarm said you don't have to spend a ton of money. I started running in some shoes I already had (Brooks Adrenaline) and have since switched to New Balance 1080 and New Balance Fresh Foam More. The first time I got the 1080s I told my wife it was like running on a cloud. They are super cushioned and the Fresh Foam More shoes are even more cushioned. I feel it helps a lot with the impact. Like disarm I got last years model. I paid $119 for the 1080s and $99 for the Fresh Foam. I also used some Fresh Foam Roav Trail shoes and they are pretty good too (just not a cush as the 1080s or the More). I got them at Joe's New Balance Outlet. They still have the fresh foam more for $99 (MSRP is $165). They also have some NB 8x0s in stock which is another good running shoe. New Balance also tend to run wide so you may be able to get away with a standard width shoe.

3. Hot, humid weather sucks. I usually run in the morning but not always. Iowa is probably similar to Indiana with temps in the high 80s and humidity in the 90s. When I run in the afternoon it's hot and humid. But when I run in the morning it's still hot and humid. We try to go in the morning, though.

4. I have no idea. I was in decent shape before from biking and my wife was training for a half marathon (which got cancelled). She's a big proponent of running at heart rate pace (about 130-150 bpm) and that worked well for me. We just built our distance over time. Running at the slower pace also helps with joints. I used to do a lot of run/walk like in the C25ks but that didn't work for me. Never really improved. I''ve improved a lot trying to run at heart rate pace. Just know that there are alternatives and nothing works for everyone.
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Re: Running

Post by Blackhawk »

I will think about Runkeeper. I'm trying to avoid over-investing until I'm certain I'll take full advantage of it. I have a habit of getting enthusiastic, spending, and then not following through.

I am really self-conscious to begin with, and the idea of jiggling my lard down the street is a little intimidating in a town where people don't run. Every couple of years I'll see someone run by every couple of days for a couple of weeks. Other than that? Nada. It does help that I'm actually lighter than I have been in 20 years, and probably in better shape than I have been in 30 - possibly ever. I just wish I hadn't waited until I was 48 to do it.
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