The Thirteenth Doctor
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- hepcat
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
Does that mean BBC America won't have it anymore, or just Amazon? I chose YTTV in part because it brings me the Doctor via BBCA.JCC wrote: ↑Wed Jan 08, 2020 1:41 pm So, I just became aware today that Prime has lost all of its "free for Prime users" Doctor Who content. Warner bought the exclusive rights to stream Doctor Who in the US for their HBO Max streaming service. The problem is that HBO Max isn't coming until May. So, apparently a lot of Prime users are pissed.
Just an FYI for anyone looking for it on Prime and wondering what happened.
I'm in the camp that likes Jodi Whittaker well enough, but find the companions so generic that I can't even tell you any of their names. I gather from some of the more recent comments that they'll get better. I hope so. I watched part 1 of the season opener and am unexcited to see part 2. IDK if it's poor scripts or boring companions, but I don't think it's the Doctor's fault that I just can't get into it.
(Footnote: my cable company only had BBCA in standard def, so I'm seeing Dr Who in high def for the first time. Sadly, it doesn't clarify the accents. Much of the dialog is still unintelligible. )
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
No impact to BBCA. It only affects Amazon Prime.
Black Lives Matter
"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don't alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views." - The 4th Doctor
"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don't alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views." - The 4th Doctor
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
So last night's episode was a total mind fuck! Avoid any entertainment centric news feeds at all costs! In fact, it's best to get off the internet upon reading this until you have watched it.
Last edited by JCC on Mon Jan 27, 2020 3:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Black Lives Matter
"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don't alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views." - The 4th Doctor
"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don't alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views." - The 4th Doctor
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
I'm a couple of episodes behind. Watched "Orphan 55" last night...a (mostly lame) monster-of-the-week story ending in a lecture about the environmental collapse currently in progress. Not one of the Doctor's finer outings.
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
By far the worst episode of the season so far.
Black Lives Matter
"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don't alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views." - The 4th Doctor
"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don't alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views." - The 4th Doctor
- hepcat
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
Wow, I really liked this last episode. I love a good mystery.
However
However
Spoiler:
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
After aimlessly wandering for too long, Dr Who is back, baby. For the first time in ages I'm looking forward to the next episode.
Spoiler:
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
I disagree. I thought that was why they used dim light, but I actually think the dim light made you know who look older than you know who normally looks.
Black Lives Matter
"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don't alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views." - The 4th Doctor
"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don't alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views." - The 4th Doctor
- hepcat
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
To each their own I guess. I thought they looked just fine. The overacting was just a bit too pronounced, in my opinion.
Spoiler:
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
Take out Orphan 55 and to a lesser degree Nikola Tesla's Night of Terror and this has been a much improved season. They certainly seem to have gotten the message last season about the seeming complete reboot and lack of larger overall plot. Maybe a little too much? Already we've got:
Spoiler:
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
While there was no particular arc we know of with the Tesla episode, I thought that episode was excellent. Even the black sheep of the season (so far) Orphan 55 wasn't awful. Just sort of ho hum.Daveman wrote: ↑Tue Jan 28, 2020 12:49 pm Take out Orphan 55 and to a lesser degree Nikola Tesla's Night of Terror and this has been a much improved season. They certainly seem to have gotten the message last season about the seeming complete reboot and lack of larger overall plot. Maybe a little too much? Already we've got:
Spoiler:
Spoiler:
Black Lives Matter
"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don't alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views." - The 4th Doctor
"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don't alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views." - The 4th Doctor
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
I liked the Tesla episode despite a flimsy storyline, but I'm a sucker for episodes that incorporate historical figures. Thought they got the Tesla/Edison relationship right, to the small extent that I know about it.
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
Spoiler:
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
Kelric,
Showrunner Chris Chibnall has gone on record saying...
Showrunner Chris Chibnall has gone on record saying...
Spoiler:
Black Lives Matter
"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don't alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views." - The 4th Doctor
"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don't alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views." - The 4th Doctor
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
Torchwood seasons 1 and 2 were very disappointing in my opinion. But the miniseries, Children of Earth, was fantastic. The last season was so so.
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
Torchwood Season 3: Children of Earth is in my opinion, the best television ever filmed.
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
I don't know if I'd be able to agree with 100% certainty, but it's really, really, really, close. That was some fantastic television.
Black Lives Matter
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- Kraken
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
We just got caught up again last night. The two most recent episodes were on the weak side. Really not liking the preachy environmental stories.
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
I am still watching, but overall I'm not really enjoying it. I'd watch Jodie Whittaker read from a telephone book (her thick accent is the best), so that's probably the only reason I'm watching at this point.
Maybe next year, maybe no go
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
I think this season is MUCH better than Jodie's debut season. Really only the Orphan 55 one was less than good or better for me. Much happier with Chibnall run Doctor Who now.
Black Lives Matter
"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don't alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views." - The 4th Doctor
"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don't alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views." - The 4th Doctor
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
Wife said she thinks Whittaker is a really good Doctor; I said it's hard to tell with the scripts she gets. I feel like she's still trying too hard -- too manic, too much mugging. I don't dislike her...I just don't think she's made the role her own. Unless frantic mugging is what's hers, in which case I don't like her.
- hepcat
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
Even just 20 percent more Michelle Gomez would fix things right up.
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
Has anyone else been seeing articles about the show being "too PC and preachy" and that has been causing the ratings to plunge? I have and I can't help but agree to a large extent. Comments like this are common:
The drum for a female Doctor began beating a few years ago and the BBC finally bowed to the pressure being brought by a pretty small group of people. Jody Whitaker was cast as The Doctor. Yaaayyy!! Right? I have no problem with a female Doctor, and I have enjoyed Whitaker’s acting in past roles; she was particularly brilliant in Broadchurch. The irony is that just as a woman takes over one of the most iconic roles in television history, Doctor Who stopped being a science fiction show and morphed into a preachy, SJW talking-point-of-the-week train wreck. I have never watched Doctor Who to be preached to, but rather to gain some escape from all the crap that we are deluged with daily. The powers behind Who have now taken that from me, and I no longer watch the show. I welcome Jody Whitaker, but will not watch the show until it becomes Doctor Who again.
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
Doctor Who and Sci-Fi in general have always had "messages" in them. I certainly agree there has been a lot of it in this season. One of my work friends has also complained about this.
People are welcome to like or not like whatever they want. I remain happy that this season has (IMO) much better stories overall and thankfully a story arc unlike last season.
When Jodie leaves, I will be very interested to see who they cast next. If it's a white male, I assume many fans of diversity will be pissed. If it's not a white male, I assume many of the fans making the current complaints about too many political messages in DW will be upset.
No matter what, there will always be DW fans upset. That is a unversal truth.
People are welcome to like or not like whatever they want. I remain happy that this season has (IMO) much better stories overall and thankfully a story arc unlike last season.
When Jodie leaves, I will be very interested to see who they cast next. If it's a white male, I assume many fans of diversity will be pissed. If it's not a white male, I assume many of the fans making the current complaints about too many political messages in DW will be upset.
No matter what, there will always be DW fans upset. That is a unversal truth.
Black Lives Matter
"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don't alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views." - The 4th Doctor
"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don't alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views." - The 4th Doctor
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
I don't mind stories with morals. It's just that the two that bludgeoned us with them this season weren't very good stories in the first place. It also bugs me when the multiracial companions travel back centuries without meeting any prejudice -- sometimes they do, but usually they don't. Who knew the 17th century was colorblind?
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
True. And at least the most recent episode 'Can You Hear Me?' didn't fit that mold. And as noted, while I don't mind stories with morals, they really did manage to wield them with a heavy hand.
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
I certainly don't disagree that the political/moral messages have been heavy handed at times. I am merely saying this isn't unique to new Doctor Who. The Green Death, Spearhead from Space, The Silurians, etc. all had very heavy handed political messages back in the '70's.
I still think this season has been of much better quality. Orphan 55 is the only fair to weak episode in my mind, and while the political message was heavy handed at the end, it's not really the reason I think it's the weakest episode.
I still think this season has been of much better quality. Orphan 55 is the only fair to weak episode in my mind, and while the political message was heavy handed at the end, it's not really the reason I think it's the weakest episode.
Black Lives Matter
"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don't alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views." - The 4th Doctor
"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don't alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views." - The 4th Doctor
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
Another winner this week! Can't wait for the big two part finale!
Black Lives Matter
"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don't alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views." - The 4th Doctor
"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don't alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views." - The 4th Doctor
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
I had some troubles with this one. Not the plot.
There were a number of character who looked and dressed in a similar fashion, and then they turned off the lights, and I really couldn't tell who was who for much of the episode.
There were a number of character who looked and dressed in a similar fashion, and then they turned off the lights, and I really couldn't tell who was who for much of the episode.
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
What the fudge was all that nonsense in the season finale? The number of plot holes they created with this ridiculous change to the Doctor is ...well...ridiculous.
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
I liked the episode and thought this season was light years better than the previous one. I am not sure how I feel about the revelations from the finale. I am thinking I have some issues with it, but it doesn't bother me too much. The revelations still do not adequately explain "Dr Ruth" to me but maybe that will come later...
Black Lives Matter
"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don't alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views." - The 4th Doctor
"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don't alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views." - The 4th Doctor
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
Things I liked about season 12:
1) Sacha Dhawan's Master. He's no Michelle Gomez (let's face facts, someone that damn good comes along rarely), but he did a great job of portraying what I like to call a "tragically mad" Master. You could see the regret in his eyes from time to time over what he does and what he's lost, but it was always quickly overtaken by his obvious joy in simply being able to wreak so much destruction.
2) Bradley Walsh's Graham. He would make a great doctor. It looks like he's leaving the show, along with Ryan, after the next Christmas special though.
3) Jodie Whitaker's Doctor has slowly grown on me. At first I was afraid they'd make the gender change the driving force for her sojourn. But they treated it exactly the way I had hoped: by making it just a fact of life. Any other approach would have felt condescending in my opinion.
Things I didn't like about season 12:
1) Most of the stories were just not up to par. I did enjoy a few though. The Tesla tale, for example.
2) The complete retcon of the Doctor. Seriously, this is utter crap. It's like announcing that Bruce Wayne has actually been a Kryptonian this entire time. The number of plot holes this creates is enormous. I really, really hope they explain it away in season 13 and get back to concentrating on good stories instead of sensationalist story arcs that make no damn sense.
1) Sacha Dhawan's Master. He's no Michelle Gomez (let's face facts, someone that damn good comes along rarely), but he did a great job of portraying what I like to call a "tragically mad" Master. You could see the regret in his eyes from time to time over what he does and what he's lost, but it was always quickly overtaken by his obvious joy in simply being able to wreak so much destruction.
2) Bradley Walsh's Graham. He would make a great doctor. It looks like he's leaving the show, along with Ryan, after the next Christmas special though.
3) Jodie Whitaker's Doctor has slowly grown on me. At first I was afraid they'd make the gender change the driving force for her sojourn. But they treated it exactly the way I had hoped: by making it just a fact of life. Any other approach would have felt condescending in my opinion.
Things I didn't like about season 12:
1) Most of the stories were just not up to par. I did enjoy a few though. The Tesla tale, for example.
2) The complete retcon of the Doctor. Seriously, this is utter crap. It's like announcing that Bruce Wayne has actually been a Kryptonian this entire time. The number of plot holes this creates is enormous. I really, really hope they explain it away in season 13 and get back to concentrating on good stories instead of sensationalist story arcs that make no damn sense.
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- Punisher
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
As someone who has just started watching with the new series in general, what kind of plot holes? I can't really think of any.
I also suspect that the old guy/general will turn out to be the doctor as well. I just kept waiting for that reveal.
I also suspect that the old guy/general will turn out to be the doctor as well. I just kept waiting for that reveal.
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- hepcat
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
This article lists quite a few.
It just doesn't work for me. There was no need to radically change the character's history. I mean, the character ALREADY has a built in dynamic for change with regeneration. Each new actor brings something new to the table.
It just doesn't work for me. There was no need to radically change the character's history. I mean, the character ALREADY has a built in dynamic for change with regeneration. Each new actor brings something new to the table.
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
(Not really worrying about spoilers here, so skip over this if you haven't caught up...)
I think a lot (not all) of those plot holes in that article are weak and easily explained away. But, I also don't really approve of the retcon. The biggest explanation I want is the first plot hole in that article. How does Dr Ruth's TARDIS look like a Police Box? I really hope Chibs addresses this. The fan theory of between Troughton and Pertwee is plausible especially with the Division able to erase memories. If they could just erase the Doc's memories of being Dr Ruth, that could work.
The retcon DOES however fill a plot hole in the Brain of Morbius - not that I was that worked up over it. I guess this also removes the half human shit from the 8th Doctor movie.
I still liked the story and the season was great. But no, I can't say I am enthused about the retcon. The addition of the Division though, I find much more interesting.
Maybe the next showrunner can retcon the retcon!
I think a lot (not all) of those plot holes in that article are weak and easily explained away. But, I also don't really approve of the retcon. The biggest explanation I want is the first plot hole in that article. How does Dr Ruth's TARDIS look like a Police Box? I really hope Chibs addresses this. The fan theory of between Troughton and Pertwee is plausible especially with the Division able to erase memories. If they could just erase the Doc's memories of being Dr Ruth, that could work.
The retcon DOES however fill a plot hole in the Brain of Morbius - not that I was that worked up over it. I guess this also removes the half human shit from the 8th Doctor movie.
I still liked the story and the season was great. But no, I can't say I am enthused about the retcon. The addition of the Division though, I find much more interesting.
Maybe the next showrunner can retcon the retcon!
Black Lives Matter
"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don't alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views." - The 4th Doctor
"You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common: they don't alter their views to fit the facts; they alter the facts to fit their views." - The 4th Doctor
- Punisher
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Re: The Thirteenth Doctor
I agree with JCC, It's currently 6:30AM so I don't have the energy to go through the list right now, but I have a question about Ruth, that could fix a few of those off the bat.
Has it been CONFIRMED, that Ruth is from the past? What if Ruth is a future regeneration of the Doctor?
Maybe she DOES know the current Doctor and is just hiding it?
Maybe at some point, the doctor's mind gets wiped again and Ruth is from the future and doesn't remember her?
Maybe there is just some timey whimey explanation we will get later.
Has it been CONFIRMED, that Ruth is from the past? What if Ruth is a future regeneration of the Doctor?
Maybe she DOES know the current Doctor and is just hiding it?
Maybe at some point, the doctor's mind gets wiped again and Ruth is from the future and doesn't remember her?
Maybe there is just some timey whimey explanation we will get later.
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