The American Apocalypse

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Defiant
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Defiant »


That congressional term was quiet enough, right? :think:
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Rip »

Someone cue the Archie Bunker theme.
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Biyobi »

I think it's much more appropriate to replace "Hail to the Chief" with that theme instead.
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Papa Smurph »

Archinerd wrote:
Exodor wrote:
My facebook feed is starting to fill with people wanting electors to ignore the outcome and "vote with the will of the people." What a bunch of undemocratic bullshit. I hate that Trump won and lament just how few votes it would have taken to get a better outcome but elections have consequences and he won. Instead of trying to undermine the basis of our democracy (which these same people feared Trump would do if he lost) they need to get to work making sure Trump can't undo years of progress.
Agreed, The only way is forward. Better buckle up though, it's going to be a bumpy ride. Maybe we can convince the buffoon in the the driver seat to avoid the deepest pot holes or avoid driving into the sea.
I guess this is the part that is confusing to me. We are now finishing 8 years of Republicans doing everything they can to PREVENT the government from functioning. Now that Trump wins, they say "you need to work with us and accept our ideas." But, they haven't worked with anyone or accepted other ideas in the last 8 years.

WHY ARE DEMOCRATS ACCEPTING THIS? The voters just voted that they don't want the high road. They don't want compromise. They don't want facts, or science, or intelligent discourse. So, why would Democrats continue to pursue these failed policies?

Why not say "we are going to investigate Trump at every turn. We are going to make up false stories and push lies in the media. We are going to put up a candidate in 4 years that panders to the public, is a demagogue and means nothing of what they say. We will take the low road because it's what America wants." Why not?

I'm not saying that's a good thing, but if I'm a politician and my job is to get elected, that seems like the way to do it. I'm just confused by all the Democrats saying "we'll compromise with Republicans" which means "we'll roll over and do whatever they say." Republicans are the party of "Never compromise" remember?
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Pyperkub »

gilraen wrote:
GreenGoo wrote: Just a reminder that Bush Jr. preached calm and reason after 9/11, to not take out your fear and anger on American muslims on the street, and, remarkably, the number of hate crimes that followed 9/11 were few.

If reports are correct, there have been more hate crimes after electing Drumpf than there were after 9/11.

Bush LED the entire country when it was reeling and lost, angry and scared. He calmed them so that cooler heads could prevail.

Drumpf has scare and hate mongered a significant portion of the American population during a time of relative peace and economic recovery.
Bush may have been a weak president on foreign policy (he knew that; he campaigned on the basis of domestic policy reforms and if not for 9/11, he would have kept to it) - but he is a patriot and a decent person with a moral compass that was never put in doubt, even when his political opponents disagreed on his values. Trump is human garbage.
Authorizing American Torture for the first time ever is not exactly the action of a man with a strong moral compass.

Lying us into a war in Iraq and neglecting the righteous action in Afghanistan wasn't either.

Not really a fan of warrantless wiretapping and the surveillance state he created either, but those aren't moral issues, just disregarding the Constitution
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Also: There are three ways to not tell the truth: lies, damned lies, and statistics.
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Re: The American Apocalypse

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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Archinerd »

Papa Smurph wrote:
I guess this is the part that is confusing to me. We are now finishing 8 years of Republicans doing everything they can to PREVENT the government from functioning. Now that Trump wins, they say "you need to work with us and accept our ideas." But, they haven't worked with anyone or accepted other ideas in the last 8 years.

WHY ARE DEMOCRATS ACCEPTING THIS?
Like it or not, we are stuck with him for now. I'm not willing to sacrifice my Nation to take down Trump if I don't have to. If he ends up burning it down himself though, all bets are off.
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Kraken »

GreenGoo wrote:
Kraken wrote:
Legacies are second-term agendas. The first term is all about reelection.
Fair enough and good point. Why are we talking about legacies then? And by we, I mean Joe Scarborough.
:lol: Pretty sure you have to take office before you start thinking of your legacy.

Trump's economic plan might ensure him a second term, but that legacy thing is going to be a bitch when the chickens come home to roost.
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by raydude »

Archinerd wrote:
Papa Smurph wrote:
I guess this is the part that is confusing to me. We are now finishing 8 years of Republicans doing everything they can to PREVENT the government from functioning. Now that Trump wins, they say "you need to work with us and accept our ideas." But, they haven't worked with anyone or accepted other ideas in the last 8 years.

WHY ARE DEMOCRATS ACCEPTING THIS?
Like it or not, we are stuck with him for now. I'm not willing to sacrifice my Nation to take down Trump if I don't have to. If he ends up burning it down himself though, all bets are off.
Because that's not what we do. If we're truly convinced we're on the right side of history then we need to keep plugging away and doing what is right, not what feels good. Otherwise one could say there truly is no difference between either side. Then what?
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Remus West »

I fully understand what papa Smurf is saying. I hold dearly to the hope that the Democrats in the legislature filibuster the crap out of any action Trump or the Republican party puts forth that is the product of hate. I would applaud anyone who got up and talked for 4 straight years to prevent us from deporting anyone from our nation or building a wall between ourselves and the rest of the world - figuratively or (sadly) literally. I would applaud anyone who prevents legislation that clearly ignores the opinions of the scientific community regarding the environment. In short, the vast majority of the ideas put forth by Trump during the campaign need to be blocked in the same manner that the Republican party blocked Obama all these years.

I disagree with putting forth a sleaze candidate to try and snake oil sales the people though. Had Hillary focused more on what she wanted to do for the middle class and the under served rather than on how dangerous Trump would be in office I'd like to think she would have swung that 1% she needed in so many areas to win.

Also, I read this morning that Trump tweeted regarding the protests going on around the nation and said "Just had a very open and successful presidential election. Now professional protesters, incited by the media, are protesting. Very unfair!"

The day he moves against the media to silence them the entire nation had better rise in their defense or we take yet another step down a dark path.
“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.” - H.L. Mencken
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Unagi »

Remus West wrote:The day he moves against the media to silence them the entire nation had better rise in their defense or we take yet another step down a dark path.
Seriously.

Know your history people...

Step 1: Eliminate the intellectuals and the press.
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by raydude »

Unagi wrote:
Remus West wrote:The day he moves against the media to silence them the entire nation had better rise in their defense or we take yet another step down a dark path.
Seriously.

Know your history people...

Step 1: Eliminate the intellectuals and the press.
Well of course this! The original argument was for fighting false stories and lies with other false stories and lies, and getting our own pandering demagogue. The original argument is what I can't get behind, but sign me up for fighting for our basic rights and freedoms.
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Re: The American Apocalypse

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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Skinypupy »

Side note: Do we need to send out a search party for YK? I've thoroughly enjoyed seeing his well-articulated moderate voice through this entire election process, but hasn't posted since Saturday. That seems odd. :?
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Archinerd »

Remus West wrote:I fully understand what papa Smurf is saying. I hold dearly to the hope that the Democrats in the legislature filibuster the crap out of any action Trump or the Republican party puts forth that is the product of hate. I would applaud anyone who got up and talked for 4 straight years to prevent us from deporting anyone from our nation or building a wall between ourselves and the rest of the world - figuratively or (sadly) literally. I would applaud anyone who prevents legislation that clearly ignores the opinions of the scientific community regarding the environment. In short, the vast majority of the ideas put forth by Trump during the campaign need to be blocked in the same manner that the Republican party blocked Obama all these years.
Yeah, I was thinking about my initial response to his question on my drive in this morning and I don't think I fully understood what he was saying.

I think we're all in a wait and see period at the moment though.
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Xmann »

Skinypupy wrote:Side note: Do we need to send out a search party for YK? I've thoroughly enjoyed seeing his well-articulated moderate voice through this entire election process, but hasn't posted since Saturday. That seems odd. :?
I was wondering the same thing.
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Smoove_B »

I remember him saying a Trump rally at an airport was going to disrupt travel/vacation plans for him. Maybe he's looking for another state to move to.
Maybe next year, maybe no go
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by hepcat »

My only consolation in these dark times is my belief that Trump will break almost every single promise he made to those who voted for him out of blind hatred and fear. Those promises would be difficult for even a seasoned and determined politician...neither of which apply to Trump. I suspect he'll be out golfing and letting Barron help him with his three R's the first chance he gets.

Pence is going to be a problem, but I think Trump demoralized and marginalized him quite a bit during the campaign. I get the feeling his heart just isn't in it..at least while he's Trump's bitch.

It's going to be business as usual, and in four years his followers will look around and see no wall, no manufacturing resurgence and no change in Washington...and jump ship for for the next white guy who lies right to their faces and tells them he'll hand out free hover cars to everyone that votes for him.
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Smoove_B »

It's true - maybe Trump won't be the problem. It's the guy that is elected after him that we need to really worry about.
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by stimpy »

Smoove_B wrote:It's true - maybe Trump won't be the problem. It's the guy that is elected after him that we need to really worry about.

And the one after him and the one after him.......etc.
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Captain Caveman »

stimpy wrote:
Smoove_B wrote:It's true - maybe Trump won't be the problem. It's the guy that is elected after him that we need to really worry about.

And the one after him and the one after him.......etc.
Well, the planet is likely to be a raging ball of fire by then, so this worry may be moot.
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Re: The American Apocalypse

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hepcat wrote:My only consolation in these dark times is my belief that Trump will break almost every single promise he made to those who voted for him out of blind hatred and fear. Those promises would be difficult for even a seasoned and determined politician...neither of which apply to Trump. I suspect he'll be out golfing and letting Barron help him with his three R's the first chance he gets.

Pence is going to be a problem, but I think Trump demoralized and marginalized him quite a bit during the campaign. I get the feeling his heart just isn't in it..at least while he's Trump's bitch.

It's going to be business as usual, and in four years his followers will look around and see no wall, no manufacturing resurgence and no change in Washington...and jump ship for for the next white guy who lies right to their faces and tells them he'll hand out free hover cars to everyone that votes for him.
Trump could realize that governing is hard and decide that he has set the foundation for true change in America and is stepping down at the end of his term as Pence smiles evilly in the background...
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by LordMortis »

$iljanus wrote:
hepcat wrote:My only consolation in these dark times is my belief that Trump will break almost every single promise he made to those who voted for him out of blind hatred and fear. Those promises would be difficult for even a seasoned and determined politician...neither of which apply to Trump. I suspect he'll be out golfing and letting Barron help him with his three R's the first chance he gets.

Pence is going to be a problem, but I think Trump demoralized and marginalized him quite a bit during the campaign. I get the feeling his heart just isn't in it..at least while he's Trump's bitch.

It's going to be business as usual, and in four years his followers will look around and see no wall, no manufacturing resurgence and no change in Washington...and jump ship for for the next white guy who lies right to their faces and tells them he'll hand out free hover cars to everyone that votes for him.
Trump could realize that governing is hard and decide that he has set the foundation for true change in America and is stepping down at the end of his term as Pence smiles evilly in the background...
I fear Pence far more than I fear Trump. Trump, to date, is talk, beyond the people he is surrounding himself with. Pence has a long history of using his governing chair to enforce hate masked as bigotry masked as liberty for the chosen masked as liberty for all.
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Blackhawk »

Everyone assumes that Trump will make it four years. What kind of odds are they laying that he's impeached long before then, leaving us a Pence in office?

I was just reading last night that the trial he's due to start in two weeks may be delayed until after the inauguration. The President would be sitting in a courtroom as a defendant.
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by LordMortis »

Blackhawk wrote:I was just reading last night that the trial he's due to start in two weeks may be delayed until after the inauguration. The President would be sitting in a courtroom as a defendant.
I had been asking about that. I really wonder how that will work.
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Zarathud »

All they have to do is sneak one or more Trumpistas onto the jury.

Trump ended his tax problems, capped his risk on Trump University and the rape trial, saved himself billions of dollars in estate taxes, and gained access to federal intel for his business empire.
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Re: The American Apocalypse

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Blackhawk wrote:Everyone assumes that Trump will make it four years. What kind of odds are they laying that he's impeached long before then, leaving us a Pence in office?

I was just reading last night that the trial he's due to start in two weeks may be delayed until after the inauguration. The President would be sitting in a courtroom as a defendant.
I'm not sure whether a President Pence would be better or worse than a President Trump. Talk about your no-win situations.

Maybe we'll be lucky and the West Wing will do a repeat of the VP having to resign because of a sex scandal before the season finale. I think a President Ryan would be a lot more preferable than either of them.
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Remus West »

Defiant wrote:I think a President Ryan would be a lot more preferable than either of them.
That is a horrible horrible thought. Mostly for its accuracy. :cry:
“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.” - H.L. Mencken
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Re: The American Apocalypse

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LordMortis wrote:
Blackhawk wrote:I was just reading last night that the trial he's due to start in two weeks may be delayed until after the inauguration. The President would be sitting in a courtroom as a defendant.
I had been asking about that. I really wonder how that will work.
If Trump has any sense, he'll follow the advice of the judge he criticized for being a "hater of Donald Trump":
Fortune.com wrote:The U.S. judge overseeing a lawsuit against President-elect Donald Trump and his Trump University told both sides they would be wise to settle the case “given all else that’s involved.”
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by RunningMn9 »

For all those thinking that it will be fine because Trump is too incompetent to fulfill his promises. We knew that going in (since his promises are mostly impossible). My fear right now concerns the Cabinet.

That is where the true damage of his Presidency will come from.
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Newcastle »

Well...one small strand of hope as liberals...is that he may be too busy extracting revenge on non supportive GOP folks to fully focus on decimating 'Merica....well in the short term....democrats time will come....interesting that its news that he's seeking revenge on these folks...don't bode well at all...

http://www.politico.com/story/2016/11/t ... nge-231222

the other thing is that have at best about 18-19 months I'd say before the 2018 congressional elections kick in. If he's too busy extracting revenge, maybe he's too busy to really screwing up America.
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Blackhawk »

Defiant wrote:
Blackhawk wrote:Everyone assumes that Trump will make it four years. What kind of odds are they laying that he's impeached long before then, leaving us a Pence in office?

I was just reading last night that the trial he's due to start in two weeks may be delayed until after the inauguration. The President would be sitting in a courtroom as a defendant.
I'm not sure whether a President Pence would be better or worse than a President Trump. Talk about your no-win situations.
It's hard to say. Pence is more hateful than Trump, but less dangerous. Trump is ignorant when it comes to science and the environment. He's your grandmother. Pence is a nutjob when it comes to science and the environment. He's your uncle that doesn't get invited to Thanksgiving because he won't shut up about the moon landing.

At the same time, Pence hasn't made enemies of his entire party and is an experienced politician. He could probably get a lot more done than Trump. At least with Trump there is a chance of infighting shutting him down.
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Zarathud »

Trump will have his signature legislation, including major tax changes, up for a vote by August 2017. Don't kid yourself that it won't happen.
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by RunningMn9 »

Who is going to bring it up? Short of toppling Ryan by then, I think it's far more likely that we'll be seeing Ryan's signature legislation.
And in banks across the world
Christians, Moslems, Hindus, Jews
And every other race, creed, colour, tint or hue
Get down on their knees and pray
The raccoon and the groundhog neatly
Make up bags of change
But the monkey in the corner
Well he's slowly drifting out of range
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Defiant »

RunningMn9 wrote:Who is going to bring it up? Short of toppling Ryan by then, I think it's far more likely that we'll be seeing Ryan's signature legislation.
Maybe I'm crazy, I foresee a future in which Ryan is in trouble, and Democrats join forces with moderate Republicans to keep him as speaker.

Interesting times.
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Defiant »

Harry Reid wrote:“I have personally been on the ballot in Nevada for 26 elections and I have never seen anything like the reaction to the election completed last Tuesday. The election of Donald Trump has emboldened the forces of hate and bigotry in America.

“White nationalists, Vladimir Putin and ISIS are celebrating Donald Trump’s victory, while innocent, law-abiding Americans are wracked with fear – especially African Americans, Hispanic Americans, Muslim Americans, LGBT Americans and Asian Americans. Watching white nationalists celebrate while innocent Americans cry tears of fear does not feel like America.

“I have heard more stories in the past 48 hours of Americans living in fear of their own government and their fellow Americans than I can remember hearing in five decades in politics. Hispanic Americans who fear their families will be torn apart, African Americans being heckled on the street, Muslim Americans afraid to wear a headscarf, gay and lesbian couples having slurs hurled at them and feeling afraid to walk down the street holding hands. American children waking up in the middle of the night crying, terrified that Trump will take their parents away. Young girls unable to understand why a man who brags about sexually assaulting women has been elected president.

“I have a large family. I have one daughter and twelve granddaughters. The texts, emails and phone calls I have received from them have been filled with fear – fear for themselves, fear for their Hispanic and African American friends, for their Muslim and Jewish friends, for their LBGT friends, for their Asian friends. I’ve felt their tears and I’ve felt their fear.

“We as a nation must find a way to move forward without consigning those who Trump has threatened to the shadows. Their fear is entirely rational, because Donald Trump has talked openly about doing terrible things to them. Every news piece that breathlessly obsesses over inauguration preparations compounds their fear by normalizing a man who has threatened to tear families apart, who has bragged about sexually assaulting women and who has directed crowds of thousands to intimidate reporters and assault African Americans. Their fear is legitimate and we must refuse to let it fall through the cracks between the fluff pieces.

“If this is going to be a time of healing, we must first put the responsibility for healing where it belongs: at the feet of Donald Trump, a sexual predator who lost the popular vote and fueled his campaign with bigotry and hate. Winning the electoral college does not absolve Trump of the grave sins he committed against millions of Americans. Donald Trump may not possess the capacity to assuage those fears, but he owes it to this nation to try.

“If Trump wants to roll back the tide of hate he unleashed, he has a tremendous amount of work to do and he must begin immediately.”
link

:clap:
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by El Guapo »

I am going to miss Reid.
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by tru1cy »

I've been trying to stay out of this thread, but I want to share a few things that have happened to some of my friends since the elections. Several of my friends living in VA, NC and SC have been verbally abused when alone at a gas station. atm, a stop light and the drive thru of a fast food restaurant. All called the N-word and the typical Go back to Africa shit. My friend at the gas station when he engaged the 4 men telling them he lost nothing and because he dared to speak was shown a gun in one of the guys waist band and was told if there wasn't cameras around they would lynch him. Suffice to say he is now traveling armed with a gun in his car which will probably lead to more issues if he is pulled over. Oh and he called the cops afterwards and they didn't seem all that concerned

He isn't the only one now traveling armed. This will only get worse
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Smoove_B »

The look of absolute ecstasy says it all.

Enlarge Image

From How America Got it So Wrong:
We journalists made the same mistake the Republicans made, the same mistake the Democrats made. We were too sure of our own influence, too lazy to bother hearing things firsthand, and too in love with ourselves to imagine that so many people could hate and distrust us as much as they apparently do.

It's too late for any of us to fix this colossal misread and lapse in professional caution. Now all we can do is wait to see how much this failure of vision will cost the public we supposedly serve. Just like the politicians, our job was to listen, and we talked instead. Now America will do its own talking for a while. The world may never forgive us for not seeing this coming.
Maybe next year, maybe no go
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Re: The American Apocalypse

Post by Zarathud »

Trump did say he supported the Second Amendment. Of course, he's already changed his tune in the name of "law and order." I don't blame Mon-White America for arming themselves.

Just make sure the justification is videotaped otherwise the Trumpistas won't believe it. Not that they're going to anyway, but at least then we can expose the hypocrisy.
"If the facts don't fit the theory, change the facts." - Albert Einstein
"I don't stand by anything." - Trump
“Bad men need nothing more to compass their ends, than that good men should look on and do nothing.” - John Stuart Mill, Inaugural Address Delivered to the University of St Andrews, 2/1/1867
“It is the impractical things in this tumultuous hell-scape of a world that matter most. A book, a name, chicken soup. They help us remember that, even in our darkest hour, life is still to be savored.” - Poe, Altered Carbon
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